Mugen MBX5 Buggy Forum v1.0

[StevePond]

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mugenx5b.jpg

Mugen Seiki has released images of what will be their new top-of-the-line 1/8 nitro off-road racing machine for the upcoming racing season. The new "X5" as it's called, is a completely new design that emphasizes a low center of gravity for superior handling, and increased overall durability to make it the most consistent finisher on the market.

The steering servo is mounted horizontally below the servo plate to keep it's weight as low as possible, much like the MRX-3. The X5 however, has double bellcrank steering.
The chassis features recesses to lower the differentials. The differential ring gears sit in the recesses in the chassis which in turn lowers the CG. The engine and center diff and radio tray also sit lower.
All of the components on the chassis are moved closer to the centerline. The receiver pack is now mounted inside the radio box and closest to the center driveshaft, the servos are moved in close to the forward center driveshaft, and the long, skinny fuel tank is also close to the center of the car.
Big Bore shock absorbers with stronger 3.5mm shafts are standard equipment. The 2000 World Championship was a run on a VERY rugged surface, and just about everyone managed to snap a shock shaft before it was over. The once optional Big Bore shocks offered to combat shaft breakage, are now standard on the X5.
The suspension arms are longer at all corners of car. The arms are no longer mounted separate from the diff housings. The suspension mounts now attach directly to the diff housings, which allows longer arms to be used. The manner in which the front and rear upper arms and hinge pins are mounted has also been changed to improve durability.
The rear suspension, attaches to the chassis with hinge pin plates instead of free-standing mounts. A selection of rear toe plates are included, which allows toe adjustment from the inside of the arms.
The rear hubs are now attached via hinge pins instead of pivot balls. A single hinge pin is lighter than a pair of pivot balls, so it reduces unsprung weight. Optional rear wheel hubs offer varying degrees of rear toe also, but changing the toe angle here maintains the same wheelbase measurement for improved response to toe angle changes.
A full set of sealed bearings, a complete set of universal driveshafts, and Mugen's previously optional aluminum clutch shoes, are all now standard equipment.


For more information, visit: www.mugenracing.com

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-01.jpg

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-02.jpg

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-03.jpg

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-04.jpg

src=http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-05.jpg

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-06.jpg

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-07.jpg

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-08.jpg

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/x5/mbx5-09.jpg

[RCfun]

Wow, what a change from the "old" one.

[rocketguy]

idk, i guess to me all 8th scale buggies look the same, except the radio box is different on all of em. the lay down steering servo is different though...

[losimaniac87]

It looks like a 7.5, but improved for even better performance. I like it.

[TSR6]

The best feature, what appears to be a Personal Transponder mount!!! Woo! Wave of the future. ;)

-Troy

[rc10gtisthebest]

Looks like they moved the engine forward. More of an RR then a XR.

the laydown servo was a good idea..

Radio box looks tons better then oposed to the RR/XR ones.

[tphss]

Im Getting one

[T-Maxxahol]

I was thinking of getting a buggy to bash but i might just retire the xr to bah status and have to buy it when she comes out..

Subtle refinements but a different layout indeed i likey... Mugen is really gettting there poo together... lol... the mst-1 and new MRX3 are both hot.. anxious to see what happens

[rc4me2]

anyone know when this thing is supposed to be available to us?

thanks

[tphss]

the 4th quarter of this year

[rc4me2]

i hate anticipation like that
they shouldnt show something like a new buggy until a month or so before it'll be released...especially when, correct me if i'm wrong, they have discontinued further production of the RR and XR....so when shops run out, they have to wait for the new one

[tphss]

I agree it is annoying, but it's a good way of marketing.

and im not sure they stoped production of the MBX4XR, ill check.

[ZMonte85]

i want one.

[rc10gtisthebest]

I was talking to Jason Ashton, and he said the earliest might be avalible as early as May-June.

[supernitro_guy1]

thats nice, but it looks pretty nuch like any other 1/8th scale buggy.

[E-rexx]

What is mugens website?

[Popop]

He he, I see that the virtual product approach now even rules the R/C business !!

Just disappointed to not see any realistic rendering of the body shell ... Ah, Just kidding ;) ... Seriously, what's the DMU solution behind these images ?


Popop
www.rcsaga.com

[Popop]

You'll find Mugen site upon all the worldwide Car manufacturers sites there (http://perso.wanadoo.fr/rcsaga/Links/Cars/Links_offroad.htm)

English Mugen intro page there (http://www.mugenseiki.com/menueefi.htm)

Bye
;) :p

[chops]

Looks good. :D

[YZ167]

Anymore hot news on the buggy or when we can expect it here in the US and the price as well.

[TalleyRacing2]

Gotta wait til at least after the Silver State according to the Team drivers. Can't wait til it comes out.

[YZ167]

When is the Silver State Race?

[YZ167]

I answered my own question, it is on April 2 to April 6, 2003. So after the race we will here more about the release date?

[TalleyRacing2]

That's the word on the street. Last I heard, the kits are stateside, they're just waiting for the manuals to be printed. Whether or not that will hold water remains yet to be seen. Though, I hope they are out by May or June, so I can go get one in Japan since they're a bit less money there. I'm currently stationed in Korea, and can't leave the country after June because I leave in September. :(

[YZ167]

Well I found out some good news, I emailed Mugen and they reaplied back quickly (1 day =Þ) saying that "The X5 will be released in about three weeks." Everyone start saving your money and get ready for the hot new buggy at the end of April !

[TalleyRacing2]

Dude, I bleed purple as much as as the next Mugen racer, but I wouldn't recommend putting much faith in that until you see the car on the street. Reason I say that is that the MST-1 was supposed to have been on the market no later than May of last year, and it didn't hit the street til August. :(

[YZ167]

Well that was Mugens first step into 1/10 stadium trucks. Maybe since they are more than experienced in 1/8 scale buggies they will be able to keep to schedule I hope. 3 weeks sounds better to me than 5 months! More important is that the kit works and is awsome as we all know it is going to be. Keeping the X5 alive,
Jacob

[TalleyRacing2]

From what they say, it should handle better than the XR did, and be just as smooth and durable. :D

[extremetmaxxer]

hmm im looking at getting a new 1/8th and this looks like the hot ticket for the summer. anyone know how much i should start saving up?

[YZ167]

I think the word is around 550ish, but no one knows for sure. Just done expect Kanai 2 prices that cost around 700 =() So keep saving!

[nitromaddness]

Holy **** this thing is going to be the fastest buggy you will ever see. The low-CG has my vote. And if you drop in a sweet OS engine the thing will probally go enven faster. Or even a Siro engin(if they make one yet) Team that up with a M8 and you will have an unbeatable buggy.:D

[pedeman]

how much is the estimated base price??? MMMMMM..... looks good...:D :D :D :D :D :D :D

[StevePond]

Check out the picture of the buggy in the opening post...

[Gmanlusk2004]

it looks good, but what I like most about it, along w/ many other budget racers, is that the prices are gonna drop on the "old" xr's! When the shops get these in, they are gonna want to clear out the old inventory, and hopefully drop the price. That's what i did when the lightening came out. It hit my shop then the price dropped on the storm to be more competitive and i bought it. Ahhhh... supply and demand.

L8r,
Garrett

[nitrobuggyfan]

Is the general consensus that this is gonna be nicer than a 7.5 or a Kanai? Also, do new RC designs tend to have little problems in their 1st year of production? I'd like to get one but dont know if it might have some 1st year teething problems.

mark

[tphss]

till this buggy comes out!

This is my next buggy for sure!

[MrCrash]

same here.I might just retire my old Inferno once I get my hands on this thing!

[chzops]

hey sorry to post this here but i can't make a post on the main board..... but I heard around the track that O.S. is coming out with a new V03B??? does anybody know if this is true and does anybody have any info on it??? well sorry for posting hear but I am a mugen owner so please forgive me...I LUV MY XR WORKS!!!!

[losimaniac87]

My friend tested one for the worlds and he said it needed more work and that his 01 ran better. I know that O.S. will fix whatever was wrong with the motor.

[chzops]

where can i find info on it???

[picit]

Well my Mugen MBX5 will be in today, they are selling for about $650, I am a hobby dealer and have had it on BO for over 3 months, Ive talked to Mugen several times and they kept telling me it will be worht the wait so Ill seee today! I can sell them for $600, And about the new OS engine it will be out late june, it is modeled after the VZ .21 on road engine, here is acouple of good buggy links from the european market, they seem to keep up with evrything!

http://www.neo-buggy.net/
http://www.buggy-sport.info/body_index.html

Youll find info on the new OS and lots of pics of the MBX5

[eddfer13]

These are selling on Ebay in the $550.00 to $575.00 range.

[GT4eva]

I bought mine from Nitrohouse for $580 and it will be here tomorrow. I can't wait to get it! I was getting ready to start adding upgrades to my standard Kyosho 7.5 to make it more Kanai'ish but now that I'm getting the Mugen I probably won't have to. Hopefully I'll like the Mugen so much I'll sell the Kyosho to buy spare parts for the Mugen ;)

I'll post some pics during the build

[picit]

Well the thing is bad! Got it last nite and start building tonite! LEt me know if anyone is interested in one adn we can wheel & deal!

[needinpower]

Well the thing is bad!

What's the problem? I'm just about to order one.

[picit]

Sorry I meant its awesome, very trick, I havent gotten too far on mine because ive been working so much but my buddy got one too and his is really close and it is very trick! VERY IMPRESSED!

[needinpower]

That's what I hoped you thought. I got a little confused with the 'call me and wheel and deal' bit.

Does anyone have any recommendations on the WS7II and pipe combination?

[needinpower]

one more thing.... Can I use a pilot shaft engine on this car?

[picit]

good motor choice, I would reccomend the new Ofna 063 inline pipe, it is actually the same pipe and comes in the same RB box for way less money. My buddy just brought his by work to let me check it out since I havent had time to start mine and it is sweeeet, couple little bugs he had to work through but Mugen overnighted the parts at no charge! Now thats support, Ive never got support through other manufactureers like that.

[needinpower]

Well i've changed my mind on the engine. I posted in the nitro area and a few people told me it would be better learning to drive this bad boy with a less powerful engine to slow it down. So, i've decided on the O.S. RG-X and the 063 pipe although I didn't know that pipe was re-sold by Ofna. Cheaper way to skin the cat? I'm happy with that.

[picit]

The only OS i Would run on it would be the .21rzvb in a buggy, a little less than the WS7 II on top but just as strong on low end. I think the Ofna part # is 10057, I sell them in my shop for about $50 or so.

[needinpower]

For the money i'd be happier with the RB. The reason I chose the RG-X is so I can learn to drive before I put in an engine that does 643MPH. Like I said before, some other guys recommended that I stick with the slower engine and upgrade to a full blown race engine when I can handle it. I tend to agree with them and another good point that was risen is the fact that I get a bash or practice engine that I can use when I don't need to run a race engine.
By the way picit, where is your shop?

[picit]

I am located in Indiana, I really cant decide which motor yet, I keep leaning towards the RB but the parts support kinda scares me where I know OS always has parts in stock, got to build the diffs last nite, everything went smooth, tonite I hope to get front end together, It will probably take me a few weeks to get this done for the million hours Ive been working!:mad:

[justin.c]

did they change the center diff mount to plastic instead of aluminum?? if so why? the aluminum ones seem so strong.
justin

[GT4eva]

yup, the center diff mount is now plastic... I was a little bummed about that

[nad138]

Hi. Which online shop carries most of the X-5's parts ?

My X-5 arrived last weekend and can't wait to assemble it.

- nad

[schnitzer]

May I ask does the MBX 5 comes with Torsen diff? if not, how does the stock center diff that comes with it stands against Torsen diff?

Thanks

[GT4eva]

I can tell you it does not come with a Torsen diff. I can't tell you how a stock diff compares though... I've had several buggies over the last few years and I've always run stock diffs.

I'm just about done building my x5... actually all I have left to do is build the shocks! I am very impressed with this kit - it went together great! I can't wait to race it!

here's a pic:

http://www.midmad.com/big_wig/mbx5_build5.JPG

[picit]

Did you have to modify the carbon plate for servos so the spur gear doesnt hit it? Mine seems to want to rub it?

[GT4eva]

Did you have to modify the carbon plate for servos so the spur gear doesnt hit it? Mine seems to want to rub it?

Nope, there is around .025" clearance

[picit]

ok, mines about the same but I was wondering if i should trim a little off, also my buddy is biulding one and his front diff seams tight, did you use any of the shims in your diff? Mine was dead on and didnt need them but his seems to need them, how about yours?

[nad138]

The pros usually don't put the o-rings on the 4 satellite gears. But still you'll feel some tightness to it. After a couple of tanks of running, it'll be smooth.

[OldskoolGT]

GT4eva

Lookin good!

What kind of engine is that?

[needinpower]

Well,,,, It's ordered and should be here on Wednesday :D
I'm not sure if everything I ordered is what I need but I have to start somewhere right?
My order:
MBX-5
RB 5 port w/- Ofna 053
Airtronix MX-3 (can anyone comment on this?)
Ofna starter box.
some spares.

[GT4eva]

Thanks OldskoolGT! That's a JP Modified Novarossi, long stroke, 8 port offroad version. Me like ;)

I just ran my 2nd break-in tank... a few more of those then I'm off to the track! I'll report either late tonight or tomorrow on how the car works.

[picit]

Mugen is telling me you have to run their starter box with it, I ordered a new dynamite and it wouldnt work on it!

I throwing in an RB ws7II motor, havent decided on pipe yet, 063 or 086?

[ezequiel]

picit,
what's the problem with the dynamite starter box? I'm just about to start building mine, and
if it's true that it will only works on mugen box, then I might as well sell it. I would not want to change equipments right now.
thanks for clearing it out.

ezequiel

[picit]

Heres a link to it, my buddy paired up and bought the same one and they dont line up correctly. http://horizon.hobbyshopnow.com/products/description.asp?prod=DYN5625

[Mugen21]

you do not have to use the Mugen Starter Box with it. the big blue ofna or any other 8th scale box should work just fine.

[needinpower]

GT4eva, what starter box are you using??


Mugen21, 'should' work fine or will work fine. I'm not trying to be nasty but the reason I ask is i've just ordered the OFNA 10250. Do you know for a fact that it will work?
I'm getting a little angry about the advice i've been given from my supplier.

cheers
Cameron

[nad138]

needinpower, the MX-3 works just great. All usually needed functions from the M8 are available here also.

I would guess ofna's starter boxes (1/8th) should work with the x-5 (10250 included). It comes with posts that you can adjust for the chasis to be seated correctly.

[needinpower]

Thanks nad.
I hope all this stuff fits together when I get it otherwise i'll be ringing someones neck. It really ticks me when i get ripped off from a shop.
I was originally going for the Futaba 3PK but as i'm new to all this it just seemed a better option to go with the MX3 and save heaps of cash.
Thanks for your input

[GT4eva]

I'm using the Ofna Blue box... works great. I don't see why you couldn't start the car on any box. The worst case scenario would be turn the starter wheel 90 degrees and start the car sideways on the box. With a little practice it works great.

[needinpower]

The guys at Acehobbies promised me the OFNA box will work just like GT said. I guess this whole problem is because Mugen just want to sell more starter boxes.

[GT4eva]

Well, I ran the x5 a the track last night and I love it! It wasn't turning for beans at first but it turns out the servo saver was way too loose... I know, I'm a moron but I adjusted it the way the manual said ;)

I built my car using Mugen's stock set up and it works great! The only thing my Kyosho does better is handling the rough stuff at speed. The Mugen car seems to get a little more bouncy in the rear... I will tune that out ;) . Other than that, it jumps awesome, handles awkward landings like a champ and it seems to make traction better than anything I've driven. The absolute best part about this car is how unbelieveably well it turns. I am so impressed with how much steering the car has while still being predictable and forgiving. That is the reason I bought the car in the first place; I love the K-car but they just don't turn good enough for me... the Mugen does.

So, a little more tweaking to go but I'm very happy so far.

BTW - The JP motor is freakin' awesome! ;)

[OldskoolGT]

Originally posted by GT4eva

BTW - The JP motor is freakin' awesome! ;)


Quit rubbin it in our faces!!! Haha, just kiddin. :)


What kind of fuel economy do you get from your JP mod?

[GT4eva]

I still have it tuned fairly rich but it does pretty good. I haven't timed it yet but it doesn't seem to drink the tank in a hurry. Thursday nights are for informal racing... had I been racing with transponders I would have payed more attention to fuel economy ;)

[picit]

My RB WS7II should be in today for my X5, has anyone else ran one yet? Had a hard time deciding on a motor and after reading race results overseas it looks like the motor to run!

[spikevyxel]

What Does the MBX5 Come with

Engine??
Radio??
ANYTHING????


Thanks for your help

[picit]

No it doesnt come with engine, radio or pipe.

[spikevyxel]

why is it so expensive

[OldskoolGT]

Awesome buggies cost a lot of money. That's why. :)

[GT4eva]

why is it so expensive

It's not! It's 100 bucks less than a K2

[picit]

It comes with alot of trick stuff in the kit, plus you are paying for all the R&D that Mugen puts into the buggy, they do no build any RTR's and they are all high quality race kits!

[needinpower]

Hey Picit, you got that thing built yet?

[picit]

well i am very close, working two jobs takes most of my time but Ive got it assembled, just got my RB WS72 in and putting it together tonite, then I am waiting on my servo gears, put my Mugen starter box together and then it should be done!

[Epinephrine]

Sup, Im getting ready to buy an MX5 but I cant find any shops that carry spares yet. Horizon is usually right on top of new stuff but they dont have any. Tower dosent either. Also, what ever you do, DONT buy an X5 from Horizon, its $719. Tower has em for $600. Anyone know any place cheaper? And last but not least, WHO CARRIES SPARES!? Heh, thanks.

[FlyinRazorback]

Epi,
Check here
http://www.ace-hobbies.com/
and here
http://www.nitrohouse.com/mugen,_mbx-5.htm

[Epinephrine]

Thanks razorback. Oh, one more thing, has Mugen finally gotten rid of those ultra sharp chassis edges? ALso, is the front end of the X5 overdriven like the X4?

[picit]

I can sell them for about $570 if interested, I am out of them but Im sure I can get one somewhere.

[needinpower]

WooooooHooooooooooo
It's here. I'm very excited about my box of bits. They really are a 'kit' huh.

I need some advice from you guys though.
What kind of threadlock should I use?
Can I use general purpose grease for the 'uni joints'?

Thanks,
Cameron

[Epinephrine]

Only use the blue Loctite. Any grease will work with the CVD's. Be sure to use diff oil in your diffs. Your manual should tell you what weights. HAVE FUN!

[Epinephrine]

Has Mugen gotten rid of those nasty chassis edges or do you still have to file them down yourself?

Can the new radio box accept a battery holder or do you have to use a rechargable reciever pack?

Is the front end still over-driven like the XR?

Is the chassis hard anoodized?

Why do buggy companies still insist on using those stupid tie rod style chassis braces?

Why do the shock towers only have 4 holes insted of eight like the XR?

You guys that own one already, any noticible problems that Mugen will have to re-design?

Thanks

[eb4kidd12]

Yea the mugen dose have one problem that really pissed me off. I got the car tuesday and i built it all of tuesday and all of wendsay, didn't eat anythign or nothing like that. I got it all ready to go, i tried to start my o.s and what do you know, the opening for the flywheel is way to small. My friend had the same problem with his mb4rr. So I took out my engine and shaved some off. Its 34mm open in lenght when it needs to be 37mm, like my eb4 to fit on a ofna starter box. Can't mugen give us a break by making the whoel bigger so we don't have to buy their starter box.:mad:

[picit]

Yeah I found that out with the Dynamite starter box, but I didnt think about hacking the chassis! Ive got two brand new Dynamite starter boxes for sale after I bought the Mugen ones because they told me over the phone that they were the only ones that would even work with it! Thats a cheap shot to sell products I think, but the buggy goes together very well and am impressed with all the quality of components.
The chassis is hard anodized and very smooth on all edges, very nice machining too.

[bmaxxinit]

I got my MBX5 for 499.00 at Ultimatehobbies. If anyones interested.
I'm trying to decide on a motor P5 or WS7 2.Any suggestions.
John:D

[Epinephrine]

What losers. They may have just lost a new Mugen buyer for cheap crap like that. I may just have to go back to Kyosho

[needinpower]

Another question (sorry)
The instructions tell me to use rubber glue on the brake pads.
What the hell is rubber glue?
Can I just use a contact glue and put it in the vice for an hour?

Thanks again

[picit]

Well they mean rubber cement, the kind that comes in the brown bottle (with the built in brush) and is really sticky and plieable, I would use a drop of silicone or something with a litttlw flex before using C&A glue but I am sure it would work for you.

[needinpower]

Thanks picit. The glue I was talking about is the type you apply to both sides, let dry, and then put together. I wasn't talking about CA.

[rc4me2]

hello fellow mbx5 owners
got my kit a while ago, almost completed
few nitty gritty stuff i might complain about, but nothing huge thus far

is anyone else seeing that the front bones might be a little on the short side?

also, as for the clutch....did you find a need to use the extra washer/spacer for clearance?
when i used it, i had difficulty tightening the main nut down far enough so that the clutchbell spins freely

any tips, comments, ideas, etc...

and knowledge of where to buy parts for this thing would be great

thanks guys

[Mugen21]

I don't know how you are having a problem with starting the car. I am using the silver ofna multi box and a friend is using the big blue ofna box with no problems. take the motor out of the buggy and make sure you get the opening centered over the wheel and you shouldn't have any problems.

[needinpower]

I didn't use the spacer on the flywheel. The clutchbell tightens ok but I have noticed some longitudinal 'play' after it was all together. As this is my first r/c, i'm not sure if this is normal or a problem. I intend to run it like it is though.
One thing I found strange though was the rear diff seems very tight compared with the front. Using o-rings and heavier oil in the front I would have thought the front would be tighter than the rear. When I assembled the diffs I noticed the rear was very loose but after installation it seems to have tightened a lot.

Is this normal?

And I too am having problems with the Ofna blue starter.

[picit]

On the clutch I had to run smaller shims to keep it from locking up, I had some shims from an Ofna kit that were half the thickness now it works great.

[eb4kidd12]

Hey i'm having a problem with the servo svaer arm, the part that the servo is attached to that side of it the side with the spring, it has free space in it, what shoudl i do it makes a clicing noise everytime the suspension goes up and down, i put a washer in there but then it was imspossibel to turn it, anyoen else experiecne this?

[uDi_MP75]

Originally posted by picit
It comes with alot of trick stuff in the kit, plus you are paying for all the R&D that Mugen puts into the buggy, they do no build any RTR's and they are all high quality race kits!

I think the X5 is a great kit and all, but I beg to differ when it comes to R&D. That thing is a hyped up 7.5, those that won't agree with me can keep their opinions to themselves honestly. Like I said, great buggy, better prices than KE2 (a choice only for the deep pocketers, one of who I am not), but really just an attempt at brushing up where the XR was getting wasted by Kyosho. Now we see longer arms, diff cutouts, really kyosho-like chassis, longer, and a bunch of other things that Kyosho came out with so long ago.

For originality we have the slightly lower engine mounts... lower radiotray/laydown st. servo, and plastic bushings in suspension areas for easier/cheaper long term maintainance. And the split center diff. Nothing much more I reckon.

I also like the graphite and grey metals idea. So we can toss any engine in without worrying about colours not matching, for people that care for that.

personally im hanging on to old faithful until kyoshos next release hits the world, then I will make my decision/s..... my 7.5's still good as gold, and i've a feeling that Kyosho might do more in the way of 'blowing us away' and hopefully with companies like ofna around, they (kyosho or great planes) will do something about the prices too.

[picit]

Mugen doesnt get wasted by Kyosho, Kyosho can afford to pay the top drivers and thats what it really boils down to, take a look at the racees over-seas and look what wins, its about $ just like any racing, who-ever dumps the most $ into the ride and the teeeam usually wins, I own a hobby shop and see every kit made and this is by far oe of the best manufactires out there, Im not knocking Kyosho by no means but I dont think the 7.5 is the holy grail of RC buggies either, give this buggy a chance and I gaurantee it will prove itself on any track!

[wjj]

"its about $ just like any racing, who-ever dumps the most $ into the ride and the team usually wins"

Exactly! That is why I say the kyosho is the better buggy now because they have invested more money in their ride than any other manufacter. Like they say, you get what you pay for. The Lay-down steering servo is a gimmick that has made the steering weaker. On a on-road car, laying down the servo can mean something, but on a buggy that goes off jumps and drives thru rough terrain, it becomes a weak point. Even tho I will admit that if I didn't have a kyosho already I would have bought the mbx5 mainly because I have the mugen's stadium truck and it would have been cool to have all mugen vehicles (I will be purchasing the mrx3 near the end of the year).

[T-Maxxahol]

Yuchi Kanias yearly base salary as a tem agent is slightly over 100,000 bucks a year and his engineering salary well lets not even go there... all your paying for when u buy a Kania is for Kania to be able to run a new one at every race he will race this year.... really I cant even look at the mugen and think there is $400 dollars of parts on it,,, not bashing its just to make you think a little..

Yes I own a MUgen but am not defending.. THe K2 drives very smooth with no setup work at all the mugen takes a little tweaking to get to the same feel..(old xr) just merely stating kyosho is probly pulling 350 dollars out of every K2 they sell..( it may not be this extreme I am over exxageratin a little) but u get the point

[OldskoolGT]

wjj,

Why do you think the lay-down steering setup is weaker? Just wondering.


T-Maxxahol,

Try making a buggy from scratch and let us know how much it costs you. I would guess that it would be a lot more than $400.

Its highly unlikely that Kyosho makes $350 profit on a KE2 kit considering they sell for $500 in Asia.

[adim_x]

why do you guys argue about this pointless crap. mugen and kyosho or any manufacturer of anything is here to make money, plain and simple that is a fact. pick a car drive it til the wheels fall off and get another. if you think that cost too much you are in the wrong hobby

[uDi_MP75]

Yeah, it's not Kyosho's fault that people like Great Pains, and our jackass wholesalers over here push prices over the horizon, if you shop around you can buy kyosho much cheaper. Trust me its not the company, its the wholesalers/dealers.

Come on I don't give a toss about 'who wins yadda yadda' and most people with a brain don't either, so saying that Kyosho hires top dollar racers is no argument. I'm talking about the BUGGIES here not the drivers or the races. Kyosho's won the last 6 IFMAR worlds or whatever. Big whoop.... who gives a damn? Yeah its cool to see my car/engine win (greg deg, 7.5/vo1b) but its not a deciding factor at all in what buggy to buy.

I still stick my my statement that the X5 is just a hyped up K car. It's a nice job, but its not much over the 7.5 and the lineup of 7.5 rips out there.... I'd take a 95 pro over both right now, because its a decent rip for a lot less money than either. :D but thats a different kettle of fish. I'll leave the thread alone before I mess it up.. will come back if I ever get a Mugen :P

[T-Maxxahol]

ON the subject.. YEs to build ONE buggy from scratch would cost me alot major machine time considering i can do it myself it woudl talke alot of my time but a minimum of material. the molds I could never possibly take on MOLDS ARE expensive as far as my point....To mass produce a buggy costs far less.. much of it is SUBed OUt and U are pumping out 400 parts a day on a CNC lathe that takes a little near 3 hrs to set up and test....do the math there.. any how..

YEs I agree it is PROFIT and why shouldnt they make it.. wasnt my point the saying was just something to think about. not intended to start a war or flame...

I bet you cost on a Kania to GReat Planes is less than 350... mainly because they order 100 of em at a shot..

SO lets cut out the B/S and turn this thread over to the owners of this car who have reports to make on durability and setup tips and tricks that helped them out........AND More importantly performance of a new buggy many Mugen owners were waiting for..........

sorry guys Its now your post SO LETS HERE HOW THE X5 IS HOLDIN UP.............Robert

[uDi_MP75]

And while we are at it, lets ease off on the capslock usage too.

Originally posted by T-Maxxahol
the molds I could never possibly take on MOLDS ARE expensive as far as my point....

I bet you cost on a Kania to GReat Planes is less than 350... mainly because they order 100 of em at a shot..

And maybe work on some understandable grammar... that 2nd quoted line baffled me a little....

Great planes buy for cheap, jack the prices to the sky and sell. So your originally $500 K2 ends up costing 750. That's my seeing anyway. So it's not Kyosho we need to throw this on...

I'll let the X5 talk continue now anyway.. out of curiosity, does anyone bash an X5 here yet? im curious as to how it holds up. A guy on the maxxtraxx forums was supposed to pick one up for bashing, but the stupid forums went down so I ended up with no commentary on it.

[speedydave]

Anyone know if there's a place to get an X5 cheaper than $580, or is that about rock bottom(without hitting eBay)? Any tips, suggested hopups, or anything else? I'm moving on up from my XR to an X5. Can't wait! :D

[OldskoolGT]

Give Ultimate Hobbies a call, I heard they sold them there really cheap.

Lot's of people have jumped on the Mugen bandwagon here in TX and it appears that the X5 holds up pretty well (for racing). One weak spot is the steering plate. Quite a few reports of that part bending. The shock towers also seem kind of easy to bend. Other than that the buggy looks good.

[picit]

e-mail me at victorybikeshop@aol.com with the best shipped price and Ill see what I can do, I can get a guy to make carbon shock towers if you guys are interested in them.

[ezequiel]

I know, it is a race kit but, since my race engine is not yet here, I tried to put on my backup engine, which is a PULL START engine and the mounts would not fit. gee! does anyone know of engine mounts for Pull Start? instead of swapping out my reliable backup to a non pull start, cause sometimes, if I just want to run my car without hassles, and have fun on nearby parking lots, I won't have to carry the heavy box.:(

[uDi_MP75]

What pullstart engine do you own?

I think it might be the excessively low engine mounts/mounting (milling under engine etc) thats stopping you from doing it.

On the Kyosho, you can run any pullstart engine that has a compact pullstart (one that is in line with the bottom of the engine - including Hyper21 4 port, 8 port, 8 port race, Force 21/P4, Force 25, etc) with the stock mounts.

The only way I could imagine it possible on the x5 (other than getting new mounts, which probably don't exist yet anyway) would be to continue that milling in the chassis for the engine, a little further back - up to where the pullstart ends. Like I said though, its got to be a 'compact' pullstart motor.

I might be thinking of 'why its not fitting' in the wrong way though. I don't have the car, so I can't exactly check sorry.

[T-Maxxahol]

mugen stopped making mounts that would except a pullstart with the XR.. im sure a modification wouldnt be too hard to make it work as UDI said

[uDi_MP75]

haha towers and other metals bending - exactly like my 75. :D Except I bend hingepin brace/plates instead of the ackermann plate.
seems like a nice kit, but looks like the issues I have with my K car would be repeated on the Mugen... and on the other hand, hopups to replace my weaknesses are much easier to find and usually cheaper, whereas for Mugen you don't have cheap hopup options like teambluestar, k-factory etc (i think), only good stuff like hardcore, which costs far too much for the majority.

If the kit gets popular, so will hopups though, I guess.

Anyone broken any of that carbon yet? My friend inquired about the steering brace breaking, the one that the front chassis brace is attached to... I thought about it and I don't see why not.. or won't that happen? Just curious, because when the chassis flexes, the force would go to the carbon.. no?

[OldskoolGT]

I haven't seen any broken carbon fiber pieces on the X5. Quite a few other buggies have the chassis braces connected to a front nose/steering brace made of CF, so I don't think its an issue.



Regarding the pull start issue,

Could one just stick some spaces of some sort on the engine mounts to raise the engine up higher?

[eb4kidd12]

Yes you probably could excpet that theres a nice chance the flywheel would be rubing against the brake pad.

[OldskoolGT]

Maybe raise the center diff to compensate?

[speedydave]

Alright guys, I think I'm ordering the buggy tomorrow. Tower has it for $600, but Stormer has it for $550, so I think you know who I'm ordering it from. :D I talked to a local guy and he said the stock setup is a little funky. He told me to run 5,000 wt oil in the front diff, 7,000 in the center, and 1,000 in the rear. He also told me to run 40/35 in the shocks F/R. Sound good? Any other tips, tricks, or mods you guys can clue me in on? Thanks!

[x5owner]

hi dose any one no if mugen have brought out any hop up parts for the mbx5 yet or is it to soon.

[FlyinRazorback]

http://www.mugenracing.com/whatsnew/Pics/e0308-10.jpe

E0308 Al. Rear Tension Rod Mount
E0309 Al. Radio Plate Post
E0310 Al. Radio Plate Mount

[x5owner]

FlyinRazorback i have the mbx5 with the novarossi 21 p5 and the new xs3 JR radio and i have just joined a club in WA were thay just race the 1/8 buggies its a clay track with yellow sand .I was wondering if you could give me some advise on what servo i should get fo my stering becase i havent yet got one i only have the standed servo. also how do you get those pitcers on the screen. and can you send me a pitcer of what your car looks like becase i havent seen much of any ones cars on here yet.

[wjj]

Hey x5owner, what town in Washington do they have off-road races? I live in the seattle area, is it close to that?

[rccardude04]

I just figured I'd say i got to drive one of these sunday. A customer bought one and took it to the track. He had me tune it which means i also got to "play" with it on the track. And i'm tellin you guys. He had absolutely no setup on it at all. It was just put together. He had funny toe angles, camber was off, weird shock setup, everything. It jumped better, handled bumps better, steered smoother, and just generally drove better than my xr does with a couple years of tuning on it. It was awesome. No question that will be my next buggy unless something extremely stupid happens (which is very doubtful).
-Eric

[speedydave]

Ya never know, Eric. This is you we're talking about here. ;)

[rccardude04]

Don't make me get out my starter box again...
-Eric

[x5owner]

Hey wjj i live in WA thats not in america you know WA is in australia which stands for western australia. I live no were nere wasinton so im not american so im probly the only australian on this american site.

[eb4kidd12]

hey guys, i was wondering.... i had read a copy of a review on a mugen mbx5 and they said that basically everything is a 9 and acceleration was a 10. (Scale of 1-10, 1 worst 10 best) I though that its handlign aroudn corners was a 10, and top speed also a 10. What are your opinions on this?

[x5owner]

Hay eb4kidd12 i have the mbx5 and i was woundering if you could tell me the name of the magasine you got the mbx5 information from.

[picit]

Pick up the newest Xtreme RC cars mag and you will find it in there, they are finally saying Kyosho has some competition!

[needinpower]

I'm finally breaking in my engine and everything seems fine so far but only two tanks through. I'll give it a couple more tommorow.

About the starter box thing..... The blue OFNA box DEFINATELY works. Like someone else said here before, you just have to make sure it's lined up correctly.

[speedydave]

Awesome! I have that box already(from my XR), so it's nice to know I don't need to do anything for this to work right!

I got my kit today, so I'll be building it tomorrow and however longer it takes. If all goes well, I should be racing it this Saturday. :D

[guswiththemugen]

What a buggy. Im an XR owner and finally got to see the X5 running........the thing is awsome! Stable and fast, seems strong like the XR. From what i have seen the X5 is clearly the best buggy on the market, am i alone thinking this? It has a lot of changes from the XR and in my opinion have set the standard that Kyosho will have to follow, or better to compete. I know the driver is the biggest factor in a win but this buggy just seemed to be a LOT better than anything else out there and would be a huge advantage to any driver.
My biggest problem now is do i sell my XR? Can i save to get an X5 and keep the XR? Damm this hobby!

[StevePond]

Originally posted by picit
Well they mean rubber cement, the kind that comes in the brown bottle (with the built in brush) and is really sticky and plieable, I would use a drop of silicone or something with a litttlw flex before using C&A glue but I am sure it would work for you.



Don't use rubber cement or silicone sealer - neither will hold up well. It's just a bad translation in the instructions when they say to use "rubber glue." They're suggesting you use tire (rubber) glue(CA glue) if anything. I talked with Kris Moore at Mugen and he doesn't even glue the pads.

[needinpower]

I was thinking about not gluing but the instuctions said......
I used 'contact' glue. The type you apply to both sides, let dry and then stick the pieces together. Seems ok.

Thanks for the input Steve.

[nad138]

I used a very small drop of shoe goo just to make the pad stick with the plate when the brakes are not engaged.

[FlyinRazorback]

nad138's right, shoe goo is the way to go.

[nad138]

You can check out my ride if anybody is interested at :

http://community.webshots.com/album/80523883NoMvXv?182

nad

[not.enough.toys]

nice looking buggy nad. I witnessed a couple x5's in action the other day and I must say they looked ALOT better than any other buggy I have seen run. Not only do they look better driving on the track, but when you take off the body that carbon fiber is the icing on the cake. Kudos to Mugen.

[StevePond]

Originally posted by rc4me2
...also, as for the clutch....did you find a need to use the extra washer/spacer for clearance?
when i used it, i had difficulty tightening the main nut down far enough so that the clutchbell spins freely

Originally posted by needinpower
I didn't use the spacer on the flywheel. The clutchbell tightens ok but I have noticed some longitudinal 'play' after it was all together. As this is my first r/c, i'm not sure if this is normal or a problem. I intend to run it like it is though.
One thing I found strange though was the rear diff seems very tight compared with the front. Using o-rings and heavier oil in the front I would have thought the front would be tighter than the rear. When I assembled the diffs I noticed the rear was very loose but after installation it seems to have tightened a lot.

Is this normal?


I installed a Rex P5 engine in my buggy, and strongly suggest you use the collet included with the X5 kit instead of the one that comes with the engine. They appear very similar, but with the one that comes with the kit, I installed the single shim behind the collet and the fit of the flywheel and the tolerances at the end of the crank are perfect.

As for the tightness of the gears, It's pretty normal within reason. After about one race weekend, the gears will wear in and sound a little smoother. They'll sound a little crunchy while they're new.

[needinpower]

Steve,
I have put 6 tanks through so far and i've seen no abnormal wear on the gears. (Abnormal from a newbie point of view)
I think I will however, heed your advice and change to the X5 collet and spacer.

As for the tightness of the gears, It's pretty normal within reason. After about one race weekend, the gears will wear in and sound a little smoother. They'll sound a little crunchy while they're new.[/

I figured this one out. I bought some road tires to practice with and they were rubbing on the suspension.
I got some experience taking out the diffs before I thought to check this though. The things we learn huh!! :p

[eb4kidd12]

hey guys. I drove my mbx5 at the track yesturday and i had a big problem with the damn cva's. 2 of them fell apart , basically the metal pin fell right out. This is stupid because I built them perfectly and what not. There's a problem that mugen had not figured out that's real basic. What you do is in the pin cut out a little of it for the screw to fit in snug. This a dumb problem that other cars don't have. Any one else experience this, and for all you people that are gonna soon buidl your cars, make sure you make some custom pins so this doesnt happen to you. Other than that it's a great car, and it runs great, awsoem durability

[FlyinRazorback]

This is the first I've heard mentioned of the CVD's falling apart. Maybe you got a bad set, but mine are fine and they went together just like any other CVD's I've ever built.

[StevePond]

I've only had one single CV come apart on me out of hundereds, and I'm pretty sure it's because I didn't re-apply Loctite after replace a bent dogbone. I always use Loctite brand thread locker, and maybe that has eliminated the problem for me.

[brknwheel]

Something I alway do when assembling CVAs is to create a flat spot on the pin with a dremel, and clean any oil residue from the metal parts with electric motor spray. Then the locktite stays locked tite, and if there is any loosening, the pipe stays put. This is a proactive approach to building a bullet-proof car. My cars never fall apart. I just wear out and break parts. So far I haven't found a way to solve that problem.

[speedydave]

Steve, are you running the stock diff and shock oils in your buggy? The local fast guy running an X5 recommended to me to run 5k in the front diff, 7k in the center, and 1k in the rear, and to run 40wt oil up front and 35 in the rear, but I'm definitely not getting as much steering(mostly high speed, low speed is pretty good) as my old XR. Everything else on the buggy is stock except for the clutch springs, which are Mugen 1.1's. Maybe a degree or two of toe-out? Thanks.

[eb4kidd12]

hey guys, i went racing today, man the mbx5 kicks ass!!! i was so fast, of course my 2nd time at the track so i came in 1st one tiem out of 4 runs, but still sweet. Anyway, the cva's didn't come apart i got them bullet proof now. The car is reat had no problmes everything was perfect, expect 1 thing, but i dont knwo why this is? Whenever i get out of a turn and apply some gas, then the back seems to get all of the power, and sometimes spinn out if i dotn counter steer, I have 7,000 in front diff, grease in middle, 1,000 in back. And i use the standard tires crimefighters, this is a hard compound track, another guy with the same tires experienced this problem on his mp7.5 ke2. Any sugestions? O yea he said that the mbx5 is better than a kyosho.

[FlyinRazorback]

Try loosening your sway bar. Or you could get the rear sway bar off the XR. The x5's rear sway bar is too thick, not allowing the chassis to roll, therefore making the rear end slide out.

[StevePond]

Dave - the Mugen guys suggest using the anti-roll bars from the XR kit. The stock roll bars are too thick. Use the thinner ones and you should get more steering. Also, stack a few 2.5mm I.D. washers and stack them between the bellcranks and the aluminum center link. This will raise the center link about 2+mm, which eliminates some bump steer that's built into the car.

[nad138]

Here's a pic with washers between the bellcrank and the ackerman plate.

As for my X5, raced it last saturday and was totally happy with it. I still do have to do some tweaking on to my liking (understeer).
Fortunately, Bess (RCCA/RCN editor) is a local and has been very helpful.

nad

[needinpower]

I'm having a problem with the hub-wheel clearance on the rear. It seems like the hub is actually touching the inside of the wheel and wearing it away. Is this the case or would it be from rocks getting stuck in there?

[nad138]

hey needinpower, are you doing full shock travel on the rear (not using the set screw on the lower arm to limit travel) ? it might be that when the buggy leaves the ground, the suspension droops low enough that the hubs brushes the inside of the wheels. For me, I followed the setup sheet # for this and don't see my wheels getting rubbed by the hub.


nad

[needinpower]

Yeah Nad, followed the instructions as well. Can't figure this out. Are you saying the inside of your rims never get scratched?
The only other conclusion I have is that the place I was running last Saturday was extremely rocky and maybe some small rocks got caught in there.
Oh and btw what is this bump steer thing you guys are talking about? I understand the modification to the ackerman plate, but i don't understand what the effect is. News for a newbie?:D :D

[nad138]

I can't recall if its 26mm on the rear (when you put the chassis on top of the wheel). Also check your camber, too much will also result in scratching the insides of the wheel.

[needinpower]

I'll check the bump stop again but i'm sure i set it right the first time. If it was camber or bump stop though, it would be rubbing the inside edge of the rim. Mine is rubbing the 'centre' of the rim.

[tjracer]

Needinpower bump steer happens when toe in/out changes as the front wheels go thru their range of motion. Push down on front end and watch what happens. Toe out will increase by several degrees. The washers in the picture will minimize this if you find it to be a problem.

I've heard some suggest that it helps landing on jumps. I don't know but I put the washers in since I'm used to driving with no bump steer.

Tom

[nad138]

I've had my first "casualty" on my X5 and that's the ackerman plate, it got bent. I'm sure it came from one of my bad landings. What the pros suggested is to double the plate (and remove the ears on one of them) . Sandwich this plate with a new one and you can get rid of the washers. What this does is strengthen the ackerman and get rid of the bump steer.

[speedydave]

I'm not even using the setscrews in the arms, and my rims don't rub anything. I just stick with ProLine rims.

[eb4kidd12]

Same here, I didn't put the set screws in because my arms don't touch my chassy when my suspension is fully extended. Goin racing sunday can't wait. The only guy at the track with the mbx5, everyoen always checks it out in action and in the pits.

[G24racer]

What tires come with the kit?

[FlyinRazorback]

Proline crimefighters M2 compound.

[Strike 4]

I got a MBX 4 and if I get the 5 what are the most large differences???

[speedydave]

Ran mine for the second time on Saturday. I absolutely love this buggy. It handles bumps much better than my XR did, and jumps much flatter and without as much correction needed. The buggy also seems to be more predictable, and I don't really feel like I need to push it as hard as my XR. I noticed that the buggy lacks a little low speed steering, so I added about 1-1.5* toe-out, and added a little more rear brake bias and that basically took care of that problem, but I'm also not running totally box stock setup, so that could be part of it. Not all the fast guys were there, but the top four of us in expert 1/8 were each a second apart from the next. I took the TQ and the win in the main, which is a first for me in expert. :D Second place was also an MBX5, followed by two K2's. Can't wait for Pro-Series to roll around here in August so I can see how some of the factory guys are doing with the buggy. :)


Strike4 - There are quite a few differences you can notice just by looking at the two side by side. Most noticable is the laydown steering servo(I'm surprised it took this long for someone to do this...), which lowers the car's CG. Also, a big difference is where the arms mount. On the MBX4, the arms were mounted to the chassis directly, but on the MBX5, the arms are mounted with mounts attached directly to the diff cases(like the Kyosho MP7.5), not to the chassis. This allows the arms to be longer while still maintaining legal width, which creates a more stable buggy. Also, another difference, which won't change performance(much), but does make things easier on the owner is the new radio box and personal transponder mount. The radio box now has the receiver pack closest to the center of the chassis, which does a couple things: moves more weight to the center of the buggy, which makes it easier for the buggy to transition in corners and moves the receiver farther from the engine to reduce glitching. The new radio box is also easier to get into, instead of removing two screws to get to the receiver, you simply remove a body clip, and the cover pops off, exposing the receiver. There are a bunch of other differences, most of which just lower CG: the chassis has slots machined in to let the diffs sit lower in the chassis and there is another part machined away in front of the flywheel hole to allow clutchbell clearance so the engine can be mounted lower. There's also some trick carbon fiber stuff, aluminum clutch shoes, and Big Bore shocks are included, instead of being a $130-140 option. That's pretty much all the differences I can come up with that you'd really care about, and each one is "large" in its own way. Sorry for the long explanation.

[speedydave]

Steve, I just got the new RCCA with your review of the MBX5 today. Is it just me, or did you install the rear hubs/axle carriers backward? I thought they're supposed to sweep forward so the turnbuckles aren't at a funky swept-back angle? Great article, just noticed that in one of the pics and thought it looked a bit off. :)

[G24racer]

The rear hubs have a lip on the backside of them with two holes in it. With the lips facing to the rear of the car the turnbuckles are pretty straight. I haven't seen the pics in RCCA yet.

[needinpower]

Where can I get an 'online' copy of this mag?? (RCCA)
I've looked around but I can't find it in Mexico.
I'm very interested in reading that article.

[StevePond]

Originally posted by speedydave
Steve, I just got the new RCCA with your review of the MBX5 today. Is it just me, or did you install the rear hubs/axle carriers backward? I thought they're supposed to sweep forward so the turnbuckles aren't at a funky swept-back angle? Great article, just noticed that in one of the pics and thought it looked a bit off. :)

Yup, they're swapped to the opposite sides. I looked at the damn instructions three times because it looked awkward, but it looked like I had it right ;) . Upon further inspection, the rear assembly is shown facing forward during the initial steps of assembling the rear suspension, but then switches to a rear view and I didn't catch that part. It explains why I had a little binding with the upper link, but it otherwise didn't affect the performance. I've since flipped them around and it feels pretty much the same. Whooops! ;) :D :D

[not.enough.toys]

Same problem here with the rear sliding out. I started with the stock diff fluid setup. Last night changed to no o-rings in any diffs , 7k center, 5k front, and rear 2k. Still sliding out. Then I noticed that someone said to swap the sway bar out and put the xr in. Has anyone done this and what were the effects. Any other suggestions for diff fluid? Could it be that I just need to have more time behind the wheel, hmmm.

[speedydave]

Originally posted by StevePond
Yup, they're swapped to the opposite sides. I looked at the damn instructions three times because it looked awkward, but it looked like I had it right ;) . Upon further inspection, the rear assembly is shown facing forward during the initial steps of assembling the rear suspension, but then switches to a rear view and I didn't catch that part. It explains why I had a little binding with the upper link, but it otherwise didn't affect the performance. I've since flipped them around and it feels pretty much the same. Whooops! ;) :D :D

Yeah, there were a couple points in the instructions where I couldn't tell which direction, or which hole something went in, so I'd just look at the box's pics. ;) BTW, I like the new little rating bar feature, and the top speed being included in the info in every article is pretty cool! :)

This isn't really related to the MBX5, but I figure since Steve checks this thread, I might as well ask it(and anyone else feel free to reply). I'm running an RB WS7 in my buggy, and it makes good power around 230-250*, running 20% O'Donnell fuel. I know this is safe running temp for the engine, but would I notice any difference in anything other than temp if I went to an O'Donnell head? I've been hearing a lot of people here who have the WS7 with an O'Donnell head make good power at like 205, so it made me start to wonder. Also, what length plug should I be using in the RB? I've been using MC9's, I assume that's fine, right? Thanks. :)

[OldskoolGT]

speedydave,

An Odonnell Head will drop temps about 30 degrees. The guys I run with who have OD heads on their RB engines definitely can run their engines leaner with lower temps compared to my stock WS7. A C5 head on a WS7 is also performs similarly to the OD head. Another good head for is the Nova head. It cools even better than any head I have ever seen, and costs less too.

[not.enough.toys]

If your engine is running 230 with stock head, and you switch to the Odonnel head, now it is running 205. But wouldn't leaning it out to bring the temp up to 230 shorten the life of your engine, because there is even less fuel lubricating the engine. I have a new Rex p5 that has 12 tanks of fuel through it and I still have not brought the temps over 160. Does it stall when idling, yes. Will it extend the life of my engine by not bringing up the temps to 230, we'll see.

[nad138]

not.enough.toys, just wondering, what's your reason running it at 160F ? Wouldn't it be giving the P/S + rod more stress as it has not expanded enough.

[FlyinRazorback]

n.e.t,
You need to get those temps up around 190-200 degrees. You are actually causing excessive wear on your p/s and con rod. You need heat to expand the sleeve.

[OldskoolGT]

Originally posted by not.enough.toys
But wouldn't leaning it out to bring the temp up to 230 shorten the life of your engine, because there is even less fuel lubricating the engine.

It might. Or maybe the amount of lubrication is now at a perfect level.

You should probably try to run your engine over 200 degrees. At 160, the sleeve has not fully expanded, and you will be excessively wearing out the piston and sleeve.

[not.enough.toys]

Figured the engine might last longer due to the cooler running temps. Just trying to get the most life out of an engine. I will bring the temps up gradually to about 190 and stay there. Just curious, how many gallons have you people put through your engines? And is this at 190-200.

[adim_x]

speedydave,

i also have a ws7II i run rb#6 plug and 30% fuel 210-235 my motor rips. i would recomend goig to 30 % fuel and using an rb# 6 you might be surprised but the 30% fuel could bring the temps down a bit, just use a colder plug with it

[OldskoolGT]

not.enough.toys,

P5's don't seem to last very long no matter how well you treat them. I got 4 gallons out of mine (never ran this engine over 250) before it became to unreliable to race with.

[eb4kidd12]

I hate all this crap about the heat of my engine, i am running a o.s. rg .21. I'm on my 6th gallon of fuel and still running strong, it dosn't burn anything. It has practically the same compression as my friends (his is a tad bit better not really noticable at first) who went through only 2 gallons of fuel, and he runs his at around 240F, but i still have great acceleration and everything, o yea i run between 250-275 F. So heats not an issue in wearing out your engine more. Also i use O'Donnell 20%.

[not.enough.toys]

Everyone has different results with engines. I hear anywhere from two gallons to seven gallons through an engine. I did notice today that when I pulled the glow plug, there was a little fuel on the glow plug and I could see tiny metal shavings ( remnants of the chrome from the cylinder) . I became quite concerned after seeing this as the engine only has about a half gallon through it. Could this be a result of running the engine too cold? Or could it be just normal wear and tear?

Hey eb4kidd, you say that heat does nothing to an engine. Tell me why it is bad to overheat a real car engine? Heat is detrimental to anything. Why do you think clutch bearings don't last long.

[eb4kidd12]

no i didn't mean heat dose nothing to it, except dosnt affect it to much by, liek a couple of degress you know. I mean if its over 300F of course it will duh that's a no brainer, sorry had to clear that up.

[nad138]

n.e.t, the metal shavings are normal when you just break the engine in. After several tanks (6-8), change the plug as those shavings get's stuck on the filament of the plug. Move to a colder plug also and begin your power tweaking.

[OldskoolGT]

Why change plugs? I think the stock #6 plug (IIRC) is the best plug to run. Engines seem to lose their snappiness when you use a colder plug.

[guswiththemugen]

Has anyone tried a #5? A #6 is what my engine was supplied with but isnt right for the BX21 im running. I e-mailed Novarossi and they agreed that No.5 is the plug to run. This could be just in Australia but the difference was huge.

[nad138]

My bad, I had the O.S. engine in mind ;)

[not.enough.toys]

When I bought the engine, I got some spare plugs, which happen to be RB 6. The engine is running excellent at 190,and has more than enough power for me. I change the air filter every 3-4 tanks, so we'll see how long this thing lasts.

[fezzy]

Does anyone here have the new RCNitro w/MBX5 Review?! I'm ready to buy my own MBX5 within the next week or two and the magazine wont hit our shores here in the UK for another 3-4 weeks.... Anyone have the mag and a scanner?.

Contact me if anyone can help - ashtuk@blueyonder.co.uk

[OldskoolGT]

Fezzy,

I don't have the mag, but I can tell you that the new X5 kicks arse!!!. I own a Kyosho too (just to give you some reference) I am putting mine together now and it is definitely one generation ahead of everyone else.

[fezzy]

lol, I've raced with them and without a doubt they are the most impressive machines on the track... I currently own a H7 Pro w/WS7 2, So I've sold my H7 chassis and wanting to buy a X5 to put my WS7 2 in... Should be a unbelieveable combo

[StevePond]

Fezzy, I built the car for the test (and put the rear hubs on backwards, but that's another story ;) :p ). It's well worth the money and I would recommend the car without hestation.

[fezzy]

Great, Thanks alot Steve... Everything I've seen on them so far leads me to believe they are technically a big leap forward in 1/8 Rally-X, For sure nothing handles as well as the MBX5 does at my local track... I think its a real contender for the coming season.

I will await the review anxiously.

[OldskoolGT]

Fezzy,

You don't need a magazine to tell you how good the buggy is. Once you get it put together you will know how good it is. :)

[nad138]

I agree. No need for a magazine's review of the kit. Go out now and get it. I too have a Kanai 2 and frankly, I can't choose which one's my fav right now. So, I alternately run the cars :)

[OldskoolGT]

nad138,

We face a horrible dilemma don't we? :)

[nad138]

O.GT.,

Dilemna,yes we do :(

1/8 scale Bliss...we do too...:D

[speedydave]

Originally posted by StevePond
I built the car for the test (and put the rear hubs on backwards, but that's another story ;) :p ).

I'm never gonna let you forget that. :p 5 years from now:

"Hey Steve, put those rear hubs on the right way? ;) "

[eb4kidd12]

hey guys, man im pissed at this reciever box, because its not dust proof, some what of it gets in there even when its closed, i mean couldn't they put a rubber seal around it? They haven't also really worked out all of the bugs with the new pieces on the car, you guys know what i'm talkin about?

[nad138]

I don't seem to notice huge amount of dirt going in my receiver/battery box. I usually put under and on top some foam to keep me electronics snug plus some on the sides too.

[OldskoolGT]

The crappy receiver box is the result of not copying Kyosho enough. :)

eb4kidd12,

What other pieces do you find problematic?

Since the X5 is a brand new car, you can't really expect it to work as perfectly as a Kanai 2 right out of the box, that car has had 4 years of refinement.

[not.enough.toys]

Originally posted by eb4kidd12
hey guys. I drove my mbx5 at the track yesturday and i had a big problem with the damn cva's. 2 of them fell apart , basically the metal pin fell right out. This is stupid because I built them perfectly and what not. There's a problem that mugen had not figured out that's real basic. What you do is in the pin cut out a little of it for the screw to fit in snug. This a dumb problem that other cars don't have. Any one else experience this, and for all you people that are gonna soon buidl your cars, make sure you make some custom pins so this doesnt happen to you. Other than that it's a great car, and it runs great, awsoem durability

I had the same problem last night after the first heat. Started it up for the second heat and what do we have here, only three wheels spinning. Damn! I lost the small pin and the piece that has the setscrew in it from the cvd. After making replacement pieces, I found one of the pieces ( inside my tote ) and the setscrew was tight as could be. How I lost that pin, I'll never know.

[speedydave]

No cars that I know of have that cutout in the pin. That's not an error in how the car is made, that is a user error. I've only lost one or two pins in running 1/8 for 8 months, 1/10 gas for 10 months, and 1/10 electric for like...2 years(?). The only times I lost them was when I forgot to threadlock the setscrew.

[nad138]

I hate to say it but it happened to me too...and for the first time. That pin came off but the setscrew was still there (also used threadlock), it's good it happened before the qualifiers. I have a 1/10 scale truck and have that "Tebo Ring" to retain the pin. I don't know if there is any in the market that is similar to that.

[OldskoolGT]

CVD style axles are always going to be prone to this type of failure unless you put a notch in the pin for the setwcrew. Think about how fast the part spins at. If the part is not perfectly centered in the joint, centrifugal force will be trying to push it out. Probably a lot of vibration to deal with too. Without a notch, the pin is just being held in by friction and can slip out due to wear, flexing, or maybe even expansion caused by heat.

I have also seen someone with a freshly built up MBX5 loose several of those CVD pins too.

The best solution is to put in Kyosho universal axles from a K2 in the car when your CVDs wear out. The Kyosho universal doesn't have parts that can fall out. :)

[adim_x]

i do not flat spot my cv joint pins and i have yet to have a problem. (after saying that i will probably lose some tomorrow :) ) as for the rec cover i think you guys should maybe take a little more time putting the whole rec box togther. my electronics stay pretty clean. the lid can be put on wrong i have read that some people have had the the lid coming off but i have yet to deal with that problem. i know this isnt an answer for the problems. but i think a lot of people build their cars so fast that they dont get everything seated properly and find problems the first time they go to race. i take my car apart everyweek and inspect, clean, tighten and replace. these cars are high dollar high maintenance machines. and no one can expect everything to last forever or be perfect. they need constant maintenance and unfortunately that cost lots of money. preventative maintenance insures less trackside maintenance. oh well not a lot of help just felt like typing. just take your time when you work and it will pay off when you car is a speeding indestructable bullet.

[eb4kidd12]

Lte me clear myself a little here, with the reciever its closed to the max, except along one side it has to smallest little crack opening (VERY SMALL) and dust gets in there after 2 weekends at the track. With the cva's the pin is junk, its solid and should have a little grove for the screw to fit snuglly into it, i mean common even ofna offers it on the hyper 7, and i did put the cva's together right with the original pin and it still kept falling out after 5 or 6 tanks. But yea i've been running the car for a month and a half now, good car awsome in every way, except thoughs 2 minor building adjustments. Gonna race it tomorrow and see how it goes. U guys check out ofnas site? I mean what the hell, the hyper 7 pvr or sumthin, there such posers with that whole radio tray design. But ofna is godo about prices and all.

[nad138]

O.GT, have you tried the Kyosho universals on yours ? Was it an exact fit (in terms or length) ? I have some laying around somewhere and just might try that.

[OldskoolGT]

I tried sticking the front K2 universals in and they are a bit longer than the stock ones. So if you want to run your front end wider, that would be the way to go. I think the rear K2 universals would be the same length as the X5's. The pin that goes through the axle and hub is smaller on the Kyosho, so you need to use the Kyosho sized pin with the Kyosho universals. Other than that, they drop right in.


I dremeled a groove in my CVD pins and used red locktite on the setscrew. That pin ain't coming out. Ever. :)

[not.enough.toys]

Minor problems, big headaches. I am having the hardest time driving this thing. Upon exiting turns, I hit the throttle and the rear end breaks loose( really bad ) every time. I watch everyone else and their cars seem to handle much better than mine. I have tried the stock setup 3k 3k 1k with o-rings, 5k 7k 2k without o-rings, used smaller diameter rear sway bar, currently 5k 10k 2k with stock sway bar, stock tires, stock clutch springs, alum shoes and a Rex p5. Seeing that it is a 4wd buggy, it should pull through the turns with minimal rear sliding. I have 35wt oil in all shocks. Is anyone else experiencing the same problem? I don't think that I messed up that bad in building the car to cause it to handle this bad. I need help before I toss this in the trash.

[OldskoolGT]

I can think of a few things that may help.

Run 3 degrees of toe-in in the rear if you are not already doing so. And run the car with the shortest wheelbase by putting all the spacers behind the rear uprights. You could also try lighter oil in the rear shocks.

[nad138]

N.E.T, you could also try checking out the setup sheets listed in the Mugen site. Their factory drivers (Chad and Jason) have theirs in there. I have mine similar to Stephen Bess' setup and I like it (though still using the stock rear sway bar).

And if you're really serious in throwing it in the trash, LMK so I'll be there to catch it ;) .

[codeman]

Hey guys,

Picking up an MBX5, any suggestions during the build? Also, I would assume a Hudy/Equivalent 1/8scale setup system is essential. What are you guys using to set up your buggies?

I was thinking of dropping in a Novarossi/Top SBK01 engine. Its a short-stroke buggy engine, which to me would be better for US/North American tracks since the short-strokes will rev up faster
than a long stroke. I figure this would be better with the shorter tracks, and the need to accellerate quickly out of a corner to take various jumps. Good idea? Or is the P5 a better choice? I see alot of the 'pro' guys using the OS engines; whats the deal there? OS engines in my mind, are pretty sub-par compared to the Italian made engines.

Besides the ackerman plate, anything else I should be worried about?

[FlyinRazorback]

I run an OS in my X5, and it's far from subpar. Great lowend, not as much on top, very linear powerband. The v01b is a good engine, and the VZ-B is supposed to be even better. Check out the Starting Grid for more info on both NR based and OS engines.

[fezzy]

I don't think you can really beat a RB, Whatever your budget is for a engine they have one to suit your requirements... They really do have it all, Easy to tune, Amazing reliability, Very powerful also. I currently run a WS7 2 in a H7 Pro (Waiting for X5) and its a super engine, Very fast and alot of low end, the powerband is also very linear like the above person mentioned about the OS, Its deceptively easy to control too.

Its definetely one of the fastest engines at my track.... The fastest has to be this Picco Modified PRO-BV though in a X5, Damn that thing is rapid....

[codeman]

Cool; I know a few people who swear by RB's ... although I've heard they have shoddy front bearings; although perhaps that was just with the .12 engines.

Also, what comes with the kit?
On my MTX3 (without engine) it had an exhaust manifold, and an air filter.

Does the MBX5 come with the fuel filter (air equalizer?) you see in alot of the pics, an air filter or manifold?

[OldskoolGT]

P5 is a great engine (what most Team Mugen uses), but it seems to have some bearing issues, so I would stay away. A friend of mine has the SBK you mention, and it is a great choice for US tracks because of its low end power. You may have problems finding parts for it though since the SBK doesn't seem very popular. The RB 5 port (with an aftermarket head) is an awesome engine for US tracks and rebuilds are cheap compared to the WS7. Picco XP has good low end power too.


The X5 kit comes with an air filter and a fuel filter. It does not come with an engine manifold.

For setting up my X5, I am using my friend's Hudy jigs. :)
Its not necessary though, a cheap RPM camber gauge should do the job just fine.

[eb4kidd12]

Yea i had the same problem with my back spinnin out. There was a very simple problem that i didn't figure out until a guy told me at the track, my springs werwe way tooo stiff, I put in too many spacers so thats the problem, you should have it the the suspensions in the stock area as in manual , with everything like the instructions say, except the the A-arms are level with the chassy, and the are not springy but more smooth than anything, then it won't spin out, that fized me right up.(P.S. I run 7,000 w in the front instead of 5,000)

[justin.c]

are you sure the x-5 comes with a fuel filter? because i never saw one in my kit.
justin

[G24racer]

I've looked on the Mugen site and didn't see set ups for the X5....only the old cars.

[G24racer]

OK...I found them under the "what's new".

BTW...I didn't get a fuel filter either with my kit.

[OldskoolGT]

Oops. I spoke too soon. I guess the X5 doesn't come with a fuel filter. Its an optional part. I didn't get to that part of the assembly before writing that earlier.

[nad138]

O.GT, you almost had me running to the closet and look for my X5's box to check if I missed that fuel filter :D

[OldskoolGT]

Sorry about that guys. My friend had the optional fuel filter on his car so I assumed the car came with the kit.

Why did Mugen make such a tiny fuel filter anyways? I am going to stick a big Kyosho fuel filter on mine. The extra-big size translates into more upside-down run time which is a good thing considering how slow some turn marshalls are. :)

[nad138]

Mugen as an optional large fuel filter (B0103), though not big as the Kyosho's but still gets the job done. I use B0104 and works well.

[OldskoolGT]

Now that I think about it, it probably wasn't even a Mugen fuel filter I saw on my bud's X5. :o


So what do you guys think of the X5's brakes? Most other buggies have quad brakes on them now. And some pros run even more brakes (Mark Pavidas runs Craddock discs on his 7.5).


I guess I will find about those brakes tomorrow, when I take my X5 to the track for the 1st time. :)

[nad138]

I've raced mine a couple of times and seems to be good enough. It stops when I want it to :p Come to think of it, I guess you could also do the quad brakes like the kyosho and I think it might also fit, have to check.

O.GT, where you from ? I've seen you around several different forums, just don't recall where.

[OldskoolGT]

I am in Texas, the Dallas-Ft. Worth area. I race every chance I get at http://www.johnnycoolguy.com/



What I meant to say earlier is that Mark Pavidas runs 6 Craddock discs on his 7.5, 3 in front and rear. Can you say stopping power? If some guys are running 6 discs, how can we be getting enough braking with a measely 2 discs? :)


It does look very easy to add brakes to the X5. Just get some longer brake bolts and some more calipers and discs. I guess when you have a throttle servo with 120 oz. torque, having 4 or 6 discs may not be so important.

[nad138]

Cool, I'm down south (Houston). Didn't get the chance to join the invitationals there last time.

For club races, who needs brakes anyway :D

[not.enough.toys]

eb4, I have tried the 3mm and 5mm preloads in the back and it still slides out alot. I have 10k in the center and am going to try 7k in the front and maybe 3k in the rear. I don't know what else to do. I have changed the diff fluid so many times, shock preloads, and have yet to change the shock fluid, which is stock.

My diffs are leaking from the orings behind the washer on the drive cups ( got that?) This may be the problem, but I have seen other 5's doing the same thing. Is that normal? If so then the diffs have to be checked quite regularly for fluid.

One last try, after that it is taking a long nap in a BFI container.

[brknwheel]

I don't have a problem with the rear sliding out on my X5 unless I run drag breaks. The car is pretty close to the Chad Bradley setup.

You could try thinner sway bars on the car such as those from the MBX4. Maybe play with the rear camber link mounting position or length as a means to adjust rear side traction to your liking.

[codeman]

Thats too bad it doesn;t come with the optional fuel filter ... anybody know where to pick up the big suckers that clamp in the mount online? Oh, and do you need to buy the clamp arm to hold the fuel filter separately as well?

[OldskoolGT]

not.enough.toys,

I wonder if the 10K in the center is causing the rear to loose traction. With the o-rings and 10K in the center diff, the rear will be receiving a lot of power. 1K or grease in the rear diff should also help.


nad138,

Are you going to to Round 4 of the Nitro Invitationals (everyones invited!) in OKC, or Rounds 1 and 2 of the Stadiumcross series in Euless? I will be at both races.

[nad138]

n.e.t., I regularly rebuild my X5 after every race (2 weeks apart) and I don't see my diffs leaking. I agree with O.GT about the 10k diff on the center, I'd probably go with 7k (or 5k) and 100 shock oil on the rear.

O.GT,
I'm still waiting for the right time to tell the wife about OKC invitationals as I've already told her I'm running this weekend. 2 weeks in a row (make that 3 as there's another one after OKC)might put me in the dog house :( Anyways, if you know Danny F., Nick A., Frosty and the other guys, they'll be out there.

[nad138]

codeman, check out nitrohouse.com as they carry the X5 parts there.

[eb4kidd12]

I have 7,000 in my front , 3,000 in center and 1,000 in rear, it works great never slides around. I want to buy dirty harrys and see how they work. Any one have them and see how they run?

[eb4kidd12]

Wow! i dont know what happened to my clutch bell, its all purple bluish were the clutch shoes hit, did this happen to anyone, or can someone tell what is wrong, i know its not from the engine overheating. It looks as if someone put a blow torch to my clutch bell, the bearing is fine though,. The engines fine this is the first time it has happened to me, is it from the alumnum clutch shoes?

[needinpower]

Those colours are caused by heat. I don't have it on mine but my clutch bell is rusty. It might be nice if Mugen gave the clutch bell some kind of finish to prevent this.

[speedydave]

Codeman, the filter is not included with the buggy, but the mount is.

eb4kidd, that's probably from your clutch slipping, which is heating up the clutchbell and causing it to turn that color.

[not.enough.toys]

I started with the stock setup 3k,3k,1k with the orings in the front and middle diff. I then tried Bradley's setup with 7k 5k 2k with no orings. I made a smaller diameter sway bar for the rear which may have helped a little. I now have 7k 10k 3k with stock sway bar and have yet to drive it.

People are saying that with the thicker oil in the middle diff, more power would be going to the rear. Having thicker oil ( middle diff ) would distribute the power evenly, wouldn't it? When the vehicle is under power, power is given to the wheels with the least traction ( front) , so by then putting oil in the front ( slightly thinner than the middle diff) you then transfer power to the rear. I have a hybrid maxx with an ofna center diff and stock maxx diffs f/r. When the vehicle is under power the front tires are the size of pie plates, while the rear tires are normal size. This is because the diffs have no oil in them and power is going to the wheels with the least traction. When I added a Torsen center diff, power was going to all wheels.

[OldskoolGT]

Here is a setup to try that I got from a very good racer to try in your X5 if you are still looking for a good setup.

Diffs: 5/7/3
shock oils: 35 wt. front, #350 rear with stock pistons

I will post the shock positions and other stuff after I get them saturday.


Today I tried the buggy with 3/7/1 with o-rings and the car was pretty horrible compared to my old ride. The buggy just wouldn't turn, probably because of the o-rings in the front and center diffs. So my first day with the car was not so great, but I got some really good setup advice for this weekends race.

[not.enough.toys]

The orings add alot more resistance to the diffs. IF your running 5k in the front with orings, it is comparable to something like 10k without orings. I am going to race tonight ( weather permitting) and will try different shock fluid and preloads. We'll see.....I had three offers to buy the 5 last night, so I may be converting the maxx to brushless.

[eb4kidd12]

At mugens website they have alot of nice new hop ups, anyoen knwo if there available anywere and if so were can i get them?

[G24racer]

Well I ran my new MBX-5 for the first time Tuesday afternoon. Didn't race, just practiced with it. It started out having very little steering. But I relised I had equal amounts of braking in both the front and rear. I dialed a little out of the front brake over and over till the car started driving aroung the corners about perfectly. The car was ver good on-power. It jumped awesome!! No effort was needed to clear the jumps. The car also held great lines though the sweepers. I very much like the X5. The only problem I had was after 5 tanks of fun the two screws that hold the steering posts in place fell all the was out and were lost on the track. I must have not thread locked them. I swear I thread locked everything else on the car. My falt completely! Test two with the new car will be Friday or Saturday if I can get to the track. I was running Chad Bradley's set-up except for I had the stock sway bars front and rear. I have thinner bars coming soon. The track is pretty tight with med traction and only a little bumpy. Mostly a gas and electric truck track. Too many adjustments to play with. I can't wait to have at it. :D

[speedydave]

Finally got my new pipe. :) I had a Dynamite before, so even though it's an Ofna, something with an actual number on it helps. My buggy is a little dirty, but I do plan on cleaning it(and replacing the air filter) before I run it next.

N.E.T. - Hmm, I was wondering what the o-rings were for. I figured it had something to do with resistance, but I wasn't sure how much it really affected it.

Right now I'm running my diffs 5-7-1, o-rings in the front and center diffs. I had to add a little toe-out to get my buggy to keep as tight of a line as my XR did. Could this be because I'm running the o-rings? Also, do shock socks make a difference at all in how the car sits or handles? Someone told me they do, but I've only driven the car with the socks so far. Thanks.

[OldskoolGT]

I would ditch the o-rings. They seem to hinder the differential action big time.

I think the shock socks effect on the spring is pretty minimal considering the benefits of running with them. They do however look kinda ugly no matter what color they are. That blue color looks much nicer than my yellow ones for sure. :)

Ofna's pipes do work pretty well, although their "63" and "086" pipes are not true EFRA 9886 and 9863 pipes (like a RB or Novarossi). On the plus side, they actually hold up better than many of the more expensive pipes.

[codeman]

Darn, tried to buy the buggy off Ebay (the NIB, $509.99 listings) and apparently the seller doesn't accept PayPal from non-us account holders; yet he will ship to Canada. Gah, how *** is that ... I'm not sending out a money order when I've got a wad of cash in my PayPal account.

Anybody know where to grab an MBX5 online, that accepts PayPal? Does such a place exist? :confused: Hope so :) My CC has a limit of $600 for now, no way It will fit a $500-$600US charge on it haha. Such luck :(