Brushless Motor Forum v2.0

[Soya v1.1]

Crap, one of my batts blew up. Suns a $%*&#!!

[Mr. Constructor]

To JonDax

see the BL projekt on www.RCSaga.com, the 4 wd blue one (first on the page is mine it´s a 8th scale buggy, see the tech data.
If you have some questions, ask me, i will try to help you out !

To RCmaniac324

Yes off course, you´re right !! the electronic commutation is not the problem for the esc with 2 BL it´s the current as you suggested, was my post a little confusing ?? (thanks for the Teamwork :) )
to the Proceed, i will try to get further info´s the car is only 1 sec. per round FASTER than any other 8th !!! (thats very excellent, Nitro is on the way back if BL gets to a bigger Audience!!)

see ya

to Popop

I will try to get some pics but the raceway is about 20 miles away, maybe this will take some time . . . .
But i will ask a friend of mine that he could make some pics or tell me the e mail adress of the owner .

to prinler:

do NOT use the 5300 at 12 cells, the neodymium magnet material might be damaged, due to the high RPM and the higher heat build up (depends on time of using) the magnets could "fly" away because the rpm forces are too strong for the glue thats used to hold it in place .
Be CAREFUL with any RPM that exceeds 60 000 !!
(its pure speed, but it might be dangerous for you too, the hull of the motor is only a few mm thick and the windings are no stopper for some broken Rotor parts, they could easily go through the hull !! (I have seen this at the beginning of Bl in germany maybe 8 years ago, the motor was running 80 000 + and the rotor explodes through the hull !!)

to fReShJiVe

I will give them the mail, maybe you will get the same special price than i do, only + airmail (is about 10 - 15 USD +)
I will contact them you will hear from them or from me, depends on their willing to help you.
see ya !!

[Popop]

Yes, there's also a direct url for B/L projects and stuff :
http://rcsaga.com/bl

Large scale will be the way !!
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/rcsaga/Cars/Even/03%2001/Rear-end-500.jpg

[BJMFH]

Well, Ive been working alot of overtime to make up for my brushless disaster with my B3. I'll never leave my batteries plugged in again ever.

I went out today and bought a FT RC10 TC3. I'm going to get another brushless setup. I don't know too much about onroad cars, this is my first. What brushless setup would be best suited to to this vehicle. I want something that will be scary running off 6 to 7 cells. Thank you!

[jkoppk]

I just got my brushless setup in my TC3,it consists of a Hacker B50 8S motor and a Schulze 12.97FWe controller.I'm using a 72t spur and a 22t pinion which gives a final ratio of 8.18.I'm using 7 cell GP3300 matched packs I bought from Pro Match Racing and all connections are Trinity R- gold banana plugs.The weather turned bad so I only got one run on each of my 3 packs and the acceleration was too much and the top speed was just under 35 mph according to my Quick Silver radar gun.My motor and speed control temps stayed good but i'm not sure of the run time because I forgot to time it.The only thing I thought was lacking was braking.When the reverse setting was on I had brakes but not enough for wheel lockup,but when the reverse was set to off I had no brakes.Any ideas on that?I changed my gearing to a final ratio of 6 and will post the acceleration and speed when I get a chance to run it.If anyone wants to see pics just email me and I will send them,unless one of you guys can tell me how to post them on this forum.

[RadicalRustler]

find where the pic is in your computer, copy the file name/ thingy in the top, and paste it in the attach file below when posting (first box above submit reply or 6 boxes from the top.) then you say something in the reply box (if you want to) and post. It might take a bit longer than normal b/c of more kilobits it has to send out

[fReShJiVe]

Originally posted by Mr. Constructor

to fReShJiVe

I will give them the mail, maybe you will get the same special price than i do, only + airmail (is about 10 - 15 USD +)
I will contact them you will hear from them or from me, depends on their willing to help you.
see ya !!

i've read your mail...and you got mail too :)

[RCmaniac324]

Originally posted by Mr. Constructor
To RCmaniac324

Yes off course, you´re right !! the electronic commutation is not the problem for the esc with 2 BL it´s the current as you suggested, was my post a little confusing ?? (thanks for the Teamwork :) )
to the Proceed, i will try to get further info´s the car is only 1 sec. per round FASTER than any other 8th !!! (thats very excellent, Nitro is on the way back if BL gets to a bigger Audience!!)

{I edited some lines out to save space when I quoted this**

to prinler:

do NOT use the 5300 at 12 cells, the neodymium magnet material might be damaged, due to the high RPM and the higher heat build up (depends on time of using) the magnets could "fly" away because the rpm forces are too strong for the glue thats used to hold it in place .
Be CAREFUL with any RPM that exceeds 60 000 !!
(its pure speed, but it might be dangerous for you too, the hull of the motor is only a few mm thick and the windings are no stopper for some broken Rotor parts, they could easily go through the hull !! (I have seen this at the beginning of Bl in germany maybe 8 years ago, the motor was running 80 000 + and the rotor explodes through the hull !!)

No, it wasn't confusing...I don't know why I said "to clarify"...I guess it was that I was up at 1 in the morning:p ...I just felt I'd add to what you said by saying how to compute how high of a limit the ESC he would need would have to have. :) Sorry if I confused you.

Also, Prinler, You are REALLY pushing that motor...Its rated for upto 65,000 RPM max, and on 12 cells, you are SERIOUSLY REDLINING the motor to a staggering 76,320 RPM...and that's not even accounting for the extra voltage gains due to peaking the packs......Bring down the # of cells by at least 3 to be safe from flying shards of magnet. :) :p

L8r.

[Soya v1.1]

Hmm, now if I changed the timing from mode 3 to 1....

[Prinler]

WHAT? my motor isnt rated for that kind of RPM's?
*** that dumb. the controler will do 18 cells... and i cant put more then prolly 8?
When i put 6 cells on my turning car. it isnt that fast. even geared to the moon. i think 72/30. With 12 cells on my tc is amazingly fast. Im gonna cry.
What about the Hacker c50? thats made to go 12 cells right? i dont want any more suprises :)
How do i find out how many RPM i could be pushin with different cells? i think i missed that part.

[RCmaniac324]

Na, from what I've heard, the c50 series is made specifically for 6...but I don't know for sure.

As for your touring car on 6 cells, such a high gear ratio may be the cause for low speed runs...the motor possibly can't push that load at that gearing.......what was the stock gearing??? Try the stock gearing and see if it is even slower or faster......if its slower, I dont know what to tell ya, but if its faster, then you were overgeared and straining the motor.

To figure out your max RPM, take the RPM per volt of the motor (on the Lehner 5300, it just so happens to be 5300RPM/volt. For other manufacturers...look on their site), then mutiply it by the voltage of your pack (1.2 times the # of cells), and the resulting number is the RPMs achieved at that voltage.

[Prinler]

on my p2k.. i had 72/30 sooooo i think i would be able to go higher... dont you?

[k_sw31]

Well, even though BL motors have a lot of torque, it doesn't necessarily mean that they can pull big gear ratios, like in my t3, I found that 16-18 tooth pinions worked the best, even though with a p2k I'd run 20-22 :)

PS) with that kinda gearing and just a low voltage 1500 pack it did about 35 :D (That pack sucked too, now I got a good 3300 and some 3000 HVs on the way :D) and the gearing was what I'd do with a 15 turn :)

[JonDax]

Stock motors have the most torque and least rpm, so they can use a larger pinion. Most modified motors spin higher rpms and use a smaller pinion to spin it faster. BL motors seem to be like this even more so. On my 5300 I went 5T smaller than the recommended size for a 10T and my car is very fast and the electronics don't get so hot. The 5300 is rated only for 8 cells, but the c50 can take 12, and it would probably have enough torque to turn a bigger gear. I don't think BL motors are supposed to heat up as much as reqular motors, so if yours gets so hot you can't touch it, you're probably overgeared.

You have a C50 in a TC3? That must be amazingly fast! How is it in an E-maxx? Is it as fast as a T-Maxx?

[RCmaniac324]

So, the 5300 is rated for 8 cells??? Is this true? If it is...I'm off to build an 8 cell pack.:D :p

[Mr. Constructor]

To RCmaniac324

see ya later !! (j/k) the c 40 series from Hacker is specially designed for the use of 6 cells, same with Lehner Basic series, the Hacker B 50 S (in high winding) and the bigger lehner are capable of handling 12 cells, my kontronik fun 500 and my Hacker B 50 L are capable of it (just to mention a few)

do not exceed the RPM red line of 60.000 - 65.000 RPM (either you´re using 6 or more cells) by the way, the BL always have bigger torque at any given RPM than the Nitros have (they have only a small range in between they run best) so the 65.000 limit is enough for everyone (if the car is geared right)

To JonDax

the C 50 is designed for torque and 12 cells if you runm it with 6 cells, you will have a good motor not anything more or less, is you plan on running the car at 6 cells buy a motor that is designed for 6 cells, if running 12 buy a suitable motor too, if you wanna use one motor for both applications, you will not archieve the best results in both !!
8 - 10 cells (up to 10 only on windings bigger than 10 T on a BL)
should be a good line to handle this!

To Prinler

If you really wanna drive a sedan with 12 cells, look at the lehner 1530 or up series, they will handle the power, or the hacker B 50 L series (in some cases the B 50 S too not the lower winds)
the Motor has to suit the needs and the caracteristics of the car, that is mostly a not so easy decision, especially if you built chassis on your own, try a 8 cell pack in your car it has to be very fast at all and willnot ruin your motor or ditch your esc !

(it´s a good compromise for running one motor in two segments (Maxx and sedan for exsample)

see ya

good start up in the week to all out there !!
(i really gonna catch some sleep . . .have worked the whole weekend on my new projekt . . . . .chrrrrrrr)

[jkoppk]

My brushless TC3 pic.

[andy497]

To prinler:

I'm not sure if this message has been gotten across yet or not, but you can't really gear brushless motors like their brushed counterparts. On my setup, gearing as if it were stock would be something like 10 teeth too high!

That would definitely explain why your runtimes were short. That would definitely not happen with proper gearing. You'll know you reach this when your motor and esc are not too hot right after running. I would start with the absolute smallest pinion you've got and slowly work up until heat becomes a problem.

[Mr. Constructor]

Hey I just got my Projekt (mostly) done !!
Here is the first Picture of a 8th scale Monster Stadium Truck that is driven via BL System (off course !!!)
The System is a Lehner 7018 / 3 with BEC and a Hacker B50 L 19 Wind.
It has about 63 % more RPM and power than a similar Nitro !!
(hehehehehe :D )
I could not test drive it because the back CVD´s and the FM receiver are missing (still have to wait till the 25th of month to get money . . . . .:( )
Maybe I will get some more Pics . . .??
(Last evening my wife has to make some work on the PC and I was thinking of a MAXX Killer projekt that will kill every Maxx out there (no matter if it is E or Nitro driven, . . . .this could become a very good projekt planning it with 6 WD and 2 BL and 4ws . . .
just some thoughts . . . give me your ideas for this !!
the scale should be 8th as it is powerful enough to handle two BL with at least 2000 W or more together running on 2x 12 cells
(I´m really crazy about this projekt, ideas are floating . . . .yeahhh)

See ya !!

[JonDax]

Chris Fine was right--I'll never buy a regular brushed motor again! :D I've never driven a car as smooth and fast as mine is now.

Mr. Constructor--
Was it difficult to make a motor mount for your 1/8 Ofna buggy? I sorta hope New Era, Hardcore, and others start making BL adapters for some of the 1/8 nitro cars. A few batteries, couple of chargers, who needs nitro?! I can even run in my livingroom. :)
--JD

[k_sw31]

Nice ride Mr. Constructer! :D

If only I had the money to finance something like that! I spent 4 months saving up for a 7018/5300 combo over the summer alone!


Hmmmmm, maybe I could get myself a job this summer, luckily I'll be 14 then :D

[Mason Copeland]

Does anyone know of any 130 size brushless motors?

[Prinler]

Originally posted by k_sw31
Well, even though BL motors have a lot of torque, it doesn't necessarily mean that they can pull big gear ratios, like in my t3, I found that 16-18 tooth pinions worked the best, even though with a p2k I'd run 20-22 :)

PS) with that kinda gearing and just a low voltage 1500 pack it did about 35 :D (That pack sucked too, now I got a good 3300 and some 3000 HVs on the way :D) and the gearing was what I'd do with a 15 turn :)

I Geared it like a stock motor. I put a 30 tooth where i had 25 tooth on my 13 turn speed gem. I dont get it. I thought Brushless had more torque and high end. someone explain. I was running the t3 with a 16 or 18 ... i know it was one of the two... thats what i was using for my 13 turn. If i understand it a 13 turn is more powerfull? arg i need MORE POWER CAPTIN! ok ok ok i will try it right now. i will put a 20 tooth on it. as if i was running a 6 turn brushed

[JonDax]

Prinler,
I think you might still be overgeared with a 20t. A 6T probably shouldn't run a 20t either. You might actually find you go faster with a smaller gear. I did. I put an 18t on my T2 with a 17T brushed, and on my xxx4 I put a 13t with my 5300. I would run it with a 12t on my T2.

The brushless motors spin a high rpm, and to me it seems the lower gears let it spin up faster and easier. Are you running on a track/course, or just going for speed runs? Cuz what I said should work and feel faster on a track, but might seem slower for speed runs. Your motor and esc should like it better though.
--JD

[k_sw31]

Originally posted by Mason Copeland
Does anyone know of any 130 size brushless motors?

Not that I know of, the smallest I can think of seeing are around 280 size (Micro rs4 size) the hacker b20s and the lehner 10 series.


That gives me an Idea-

Mr. Contructer, for you next project, I think you should do a BL micro :D

Throw say a Lehner 1010 13 turn and a Warrior 4018, get 10 cells and all the usual hop ups, go for it! (I'd do it myself but, sigh, no money)

Go for it :)

[Prinler]

I need to find something else then... a different motor. MY pro 2 cant handle the gearing. The Screw holes limit how high i can put it up.... on a brushed motor there are 2 screws next to each other. on my BL motor there is only one. Making it impossible for me to mount the motor with anything lower then 25 tooth.

[Popop]

Ok Mr Constructor !
Just wondering about your 1:8 chassis origin ... What it is ?

[Soya v1.1]

Originally posted by Prinler
I need to find something else then... a different motor. MY pro 2 cant handle the gearing. The Screw holes limit how high i can put it up.... on a brushed motor there are 2 screws next to each other. on my BL motor there is only one. Making it impossible for me to mount the motor with anything lower then 25 tooth.

Why won't it work? I have an RS4, and I can gear it to anything with my BL. Why won't yours?:confused:

[RadicalRustler]

Maybe a bigger spur might help?:confused:

[JonDax]

Originally posted by Prinler
I need to find something else then... a different motor. MY pro 2 cant handle the gearing. The Screw holes limit how high i can put it up.... on a brushed motor there are 2 screws next to each other. on my BL motor there is only one. Making it impossible for me to mount the motor with anything lower then 25 tooth.

There should be two holes on the BL motor that are opposite, or pretty close to opposite of each other, right? You should be able to line up two holes on the motor with two holes on your motor mount on the car. You don't want to run the motor screws right next to each other, there sould be one on each side of the endbell. I hope this is making sense, as it sounds like your above post you're only using one screw? Same thing on the brushed motor, one screw on each side of the endbell. This way the motor should be able to rotate quite a bit so you can install a smaller pinion.

[Mr. Constructor]

To Popop

In fact it is "only" 2 WD but with a lot more torque than the other 8th, it is a chassis that is sold here in Germany with these big bad wheels !!
the body is another new one, the original is ugly !!

Watch the pic at the end, the Chassis is very small at the end (only the diameter of the B 50 series wich is the same than any other 540er)
and the thick part is the battery hold with the esc and servo on top right under the upper deck, so you will have a really hard chassis and it s leightweight too !!
The whole Car is not that expencive you might think it´s a total of around 600 USD I think (that IS money but for this type of Car not that much, count a normal TC3 with carbon and a BL System it´s almost the same)
It´s a lot cheaper than my first 8th 4wd buggy (maybe half . . .)

To k_sw31

you might laugh but i was thinking over a LI Ion driven 24th Car (or 18th) maybe one year ago, off course it has to have BL, but the costs are not in a normal way, it will be around 400 - 450 USD due to the very small and powerful Electronics, that´s not a good choice, maybe I will build anything like this THIS year, we will see !! (but it is kept in mind . . . .:D)
Don´t worry about it, I´m 26 and THAT is a diference in money, maybe you should go and ask parents grand fathers and so on for the next X-mas or Birthday to put their money together, you might wonder how much that will be !! (I was doing the same at your age and hoping of finding a million anywhere, I really understand you !!! I´m into Rc till I´m 8 !)

To Mason Copeland

there are BL´s going down to 4 mm in diameter in germany (www.conrad.de mostly german, if you´re interested i will get the page for you)
and weighting only 5g and up off course, they are powerful enough to power a 24th car !! (see above)

To JonDax

No, not really, the Hacker guys provide each motor with a jig so drilling is easy, use a 5mm or thicker alu plate and drill the Motor screw places then get in a upright position to bore the mounting holes then screw a threat in it with a hand threat maker, it s not that expencive as it might look !!
Its easy for everyone who has the basic skills and the tools, thats it, mostly the 8th scale cars are this EASY to convert to BL and the biggest + they have is the great handling and the relative stable construction, where BL is best fitted in (you can use all the power BL has without watching at the drivetrain at every run if anything is melted due to the overpowered BL system.
It´s great and not the last of BL projekts (8th) you still can do everything with 8th and the parts are cheap too (when you get a chassis without a motor but with all hop ups it´s mostly cheaper than a hopped up 10th car !!

See ya

(the Pic shows the IN BUID CAR its ws not completed the Motor was missing and some drive components. (its a early stadium)

[k_sw31]

Nice job on the woven carbon fiber chassis :D

[Prinler]

WIth the Regular epic cans i have..... the scew holes make it ez to get the best ajustability. With only 2 holes... its very hard to get my motors to fit perfectly. The stock motor plate just isnt cut for it. I have no problems with anything else just BL

[Soya v1.1]

Ya, that's how mine is, too.

[JonDax]

Yeah, mine's like that too. It wasn't as easy to line the holes up with the BL, but turning it and trying it a few different ways I got it to fit. It definitely fit in a little different than my brushed motor. But even if it doesn't quite fit, wouldn't it be easier to make the slot on the motor mount a little bigger to match up to your motor? Seems like a small hole could do it, instead of having to buy a new motor.

[Mr. Constructor]

To JonDax (maybe to all . . .)

If you use the C40 series fromhacker you could use the the same hole matchup as they have the same than 540er have and the motor has a build in cooling fin and the wires will not go out at the back (wich is often a problem due to the small space in 10th Cars (8th are just easier as they offer enough roo m to install 2 BL ´s :D or three . . . .as my new Ideas are spreading . . .it has to be with 2 or three BL´s and a MAXX like truck but even in every moment more powerful than any MAXX out there, could be hard to beat . . . ;) )
Check ouit the prices for the C 40 it´s not that bad and it´s the best motor for Car use today AND there are a lot more windings to choose from (that could become handy if your sitting between the chairs with this or that motor)

To k_sw31

You wont believe me, but it´s that cheap in germany that normal Aluminium Plates are the same price !! (and it´s relatively easy to work with, OK some special Tools are used but that´s all, so wy not ask the Industry in your town to get some Carbon for you ??
maybe there is dealer or manufacturer ??

See ya

[k_sw31]

I think I'll stick with good ol aluminum, its probably heavier than carbon, but at least I can bend it, and do okay work with just a jig saw, dremel, bench grinder, and drill press :)

Hehe, I dont even buy the aluminum myself, just use old street signs :p (Thick and strong though :))

The chassis I'm making for my stampede out of a street sign :)-

[RadicalRustler]

Do the people in your area ever get lost?:p

[RadicalRustler]

For your tc's, heres an awsome body for it. it works especially well with bl because it is faster than sedans.
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXRH43&P=7 Its a viper

[yingying]

I want some to help me. Can someone tell me a website I can go to buy brushless motors and companys that make them its for a e-maxx and also what is a esc to run with the brushless motors.

[k_sw31]

So what if people have a hard time navigating around my place! :p Well I got an aluminum chassis for my pede and thats all that matters! ;)

Yingying, try Fine Design (http://www.finedesignrc.com/cars-trucks.asp), they have a great selection of BL stuff. As for you maxx, the usual stuff thats run is either a hacker b50 or a C50, the B50 is a bit cheaper, but it also has less power (still a ton ;)). You'd either want to run a schulze 12.97, or an 18.61 :)

Pic~

[biturbo15]

I was wondering if I need a new esc for a brushless motor? I have an intellispeed 8t pro reverse esc. Is that ok for brushless. I am a newb and dont know anything about brushless.

[k_sw31]

no, you cannot use your intellispeed with a BL, you cannot use any esc that you'd use with a brushed motor with a BL.

[andy497]

Ok here's a question.

I have a schulze 18.61. People with schulze controllers probably find that the two capacitors hanging out the end keep getting bumped. The two power leads come out beside them, and I kept having the wires bend the capacitors over when I'd squeeze my body on (it's a tight fit).

Anyhow, I saw tonight that one looked very loose after a run. I pulled back the shrinkwrap and come to find out it wasn't even attached. The crazy thing is the controller still works just like normal. Startup, breaking, everything is the same. I'm pretty sure the caps did something, because they used to get very hot after a run.

Anyway, it looks like a standard 25 V 470 uf cap, so I suppose I'll get a replacement from radio shack (the leads are broken off too short to re-soldier this one). I'm still wondering if I even need to though. Maybe this one was only activated with another timing/setup mode??? strange...

[Mr. Constructor]

To andy497

Yes you will need them !!
They filter out most of the interferencies that occours in a Car (esp. with many Carbon Parts or Alu parts)
try this thing: get them glued together in the middle by CA then shrink wrap the whole end with the +and - wires too with a very thick shrink (the ones that only shrink using a fire lighter or so)
so the end is a lot more stable.
another thing is to get a small box (maybe from the Futaba Receiver or similar) and but it in there on small bumpers and then shrink the whole thing in (with the box) that ensures nearly Waterproof stability OK it makes the esc bigger, but you have to decide what´s best, for a clear explanation look at the attached pic !!

Be Careful when resoldering them do only use the same tech datas that are printed on the surface (if these are melted away, send it in to be sure) keep watching that you´re not damaging the copper lines on the epoxy plate, only hold the solder iron there for a few seconds.
One last thing: if they do melt or explode your gearing is lot too high, check this out too, because only excessive Amp drain causes such failures.

see ya

[Prinler]

WHat conectors are on that BL let up mr cons.?

[fReShJiVe]

anyone selling lehner 7018/3 bec???i need one ASAP.....will pay through paypal for instant payment

[RadicalRustler]

Does anyone know where to buy/see stuff about the modeltech brushless? thanks

[RadicalRustler]

mr. constructor, whats the difference b/w the carbon 70 (gm motor) http://www.graupner.com/prod_en_motoren_elektro/6396.asp and this one
http://www.graupner.com/prod_en_motoren_elektro/6395.asp

[k_sw31]

Ok, as some of you may remember, way back in october, a few weeks after I got my 5300/7018 setup, I sent my 7018 back for repair. Well, ever since then, I haven't gotten anything back :mad: Well, I just called them 5 minutes ago, and Chris says he is going to send me a 4018 out of their stock, until they get a 7018 back :D His basic explanation is, there are 5 people in the same situation as me, and basically once they send the esc's back, they never get a reply from germany, so they are sending stuff out of their stock, should be up and running by next weekend :D

[WheelNut]

So, what do you guys think about this new Novak system? I think its looks pretty nice. Suposedly really smooth and should have more than enough power in a stadium truck if it equivalent to a 10turn motor. With more torque, and being more efficent.

I wonder how it will compare to the likes of Lehner and Hacker?

Its the same price as a Lehner basic/ Warrior system from rumrunner.

I think I might buy one of them, when I get some money of course, and run it on 7cells in my T3.

[Soya v1.1]

I'm in a dilemma right now. Reverse doesn't work on my controller, but I don't feel like sending to Germany and not having it for months. I can live without reverse, but it would be nice....

[JEEL]

I am sure this question has been answered, but I don't have the time to read through all 62 pages so here goes...

Race only XXX-T MFE which I run on an indoor offroad track that is 50X100 feet. I need a brushless motor and controller. PLease recommend your preference and why. Also, where to puchase these items. I am really looking forward to getting rid of my motors, lathe, brushes, etc. BTW, I currently run anything from a 14T to a 10T depending on the layout of our local track. Thanks for any input.

[JonDax]

Soya,

Are you sure reverse hasn't been disabled? Have you tried running thru the setup a few times to see if that will reset it? Set it with brake off, then back on, off again, and back on to see if it will start working. And try the different profiles? If you already have, then I don't know what else to suggest.

Jeel,

I'd look at the new Novak system for ease of having Novak to deal with, or else I like what I've got: Lehner 5300 and Shulze 58ce esc. There's some newer higher current escs now, but they cost more. Check out www.finedesignrc.com

[k_sw31]

Soya, I'd first do some trouble shooting with the controller, and make sure it is programmed properly etc. but, after a lot of conversations with chris from finedesign on the phone, he says schulze always send their controllers back under 4 weeks, nothing more, so it wont be 4-5 months like me :mad:


JEEL- You'll have to be a little more specific, in terms of your budget, how much you are willing to spend, how fast do you want to go, how smooth do you want your throttle, etc.

But, the common setups are generally a 5300/ schulze 18.61, or a hacker c40 / what ever esc :)

[Soya v1.1]

Under 4 weeks? I might do that. Not like it's ever going to snow here:mad: :(

[JEEL]

I am looking for something with speed similar to a 10T. I would prefer as much of a linear throttle as possible due to the slick track I race at. Budget is not really an issue, as I will recover most of the cost from selling my brushed equipment. Also, I would like some adjustabilty...current limiter, etc. Lasty, I prefer something with a 6.0V BEC if one even exists. Thanks.

[yf22k]

My lehner 5300 and schulze 18.61 setup is great. Now i just need some money lol. I've got that setup in my hopped up f201. Wow is that fast. I geared it 48/88 in Tamiya 0.4 pitch and use soft tires since its cold here. When i run it full speed all I can hear is a quiet whine and the sound of the tires on the ground. Its insane:)

[Mr. Constructor]

To Prinler

On all my systems (BL or normal) I use the duratrax Power pole
silver cons, because the silver metal has the lowest restistance to all materials out there.
as for BL only I use a 3.5 mm Gold Connector on the motor side too, all normal motors are hardwired.
This Combination requieres no maintenance and is a very excellent choice for High Amp Solutions like 8th 12 cell buggies, and it is reusable and lightweight and comes with housings no shrinking that might become loose!!

To JEEL

Go to www.finedesignrc.com and choose your product that might be a lehner 5300 or 4xxx, or a Hacker c 40 wich is bigger but might be better because it has built in Heatsinks.
As for a Current limiter esc that has 5.6 V BEC the only one i know is the Hacker Car sport, but if you have a slipper you will not need the circuit, you can choose the Lehner warrior, its a very affordable AND powerful solution.
I´ll be soon testing this ESC with 2 BL Motors wired in parallel, it should handle the power !! (I will post my readings if the 2. Motor is there (should be till the weekend))
all other brands are quiete well too except the novak as it has not the torque and it uses only a sensored system (you could only use the controller with the motor from novak nothing else)
Maybe you wanna try a Kontronik ESC Motor Combo that has much more power than everything else but is quite a little high in the pricetag (around 400 -500 USD for Combo I think, look at www.kontronik.de (thers a English section too !!)

To RadicalRustler

I will check this out, see you soon !!

[Mr. Constructor]

To all:

I will soon get the pictures from the 2 BL Motored 8th Proceed !!
(I´m looking forward to these pics as it is new to me too!!):)

To RadicalRustler

I´ve found the diferencies out, check this small chart:

Tech Datas xx96 xx95

Specification Nominal voltage 16 V 10 V
Operating voltage range 10 ... 24 V 8 - 16 V
No-load speed 17600 RPM 15000 RPM
RPM per Volt 1100 1650
Speed at max. efficiency 16000 RPM 15000 RPM
Torque at max. efficiency 19,1 Ncm 17,4 Ncm
Current at max. efficiency 22 A 30 A
Shaft power at max. efficiency 352 W 300 W

rest is equal to both:

Max. efficiency, excl. gearbox 89 %
No. of poles 2 Case length excl. shaft, approx. 70 mm
Diameter 35,8 mm Free shaft length approx. 20 mm Shaft diameter 5 mm Weight approx. 285 g

Maybe I got the xx96 and xx95 mixed up but the TEch Datas itself are ok, they´re directly from Graupner !!
Hope I could help you out !!

See ya !!

[andy497]

I've been playing with my schulze control and lehner 5300 and found some intersting things.

I first tried some alternative timings (went from softer to medium) which didn't make much difference. I don't know the speed of my buggy, but I time runtime and have a general idea of how far I'm clearing the jumps. 2000 mah packs consistently ran about 9 min even when switching timings. I didn't try the hardest one though.

Anyhow, then I decided to play with frequency settings. It's been on 9khz by default, which I thought the manual said was a good starting point for lehner. It mentioned that rpm might be limited with higher frequencies but you might get better efficiency? (that's what I could gather from the German-English) It also said you could generally try them out and see which combination left the motor/controller coolest.

Anyhow, I switched it to 19khz and fired up a fresh pack. I immediately noticed that I was clearing this double table-top jump at my track. I have never been able to do this before, and now I've got a foot or two to spare. Wow. Well I kept driving and clearing this jump every lap and wondering when it was going to end. Lap after lap I went and it just wouldn't quit. Well finally the pack died after 13 min, but it was still fast on the last lap! So I figure that change got me some improved speed and about 4 min of runtime. I wanted to do some more testing and also try 38khz, but I blew a cvd soon after, and my hobby shop didn't stock it.

I will have to give a full report later, but so far it looks like tinkering is paying off.

[RadicalRustler]

Nice going andy497! that means that some people with the same setup can go even faster.

Mr. Constuctor, your info says that the xx95 is better for a 6-7 cell car, right? Thanks
p.s. based on the pick on the kontronik web site, it seems to be under contruction. Hey, maybe you cound help them :p

[BLK]

Ok, finally got time to put the 5300/18.61 combo in my TC3. Plugged everything in, turned on the radio, pluged in the battery, heard a few beeps or tones from the controller, and the wheels start flying. I press the throttle and it goes faster. The only way I can get it to stop is to give it full brake. I release the brake ever-so-slightly, and the wheels start flying again. Only way I can get them to stop is to unplug the battery.

So, I go to look at the instructions and...hmm, all German. I don't speak nor read German so I am out of luck there. Does anyone have a manual in English? What am I doing wrong? I want this thing to work, but so far all I have gotten out of it is grief! HELPPPPPPPPPPP:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

BK

[andy497]

hum BLK...

You turned on your radio before you plugged in the batt? That is important. Also, the first time I got my together, I had to reverse the throttle servo on my transmitter. Each time you make a change like that you have to unplug and replug too.

My best guess is the esc is set up for something other than car. I that boat or plane or something requires you to hold full brake/throttle or something while you fire it up. Anyway, if that's the case, you should be able to fix that in a jiffy.

Let me dig up the url to a manual I found...
.
.
.
I think this is it.
http://www.schulze-elektronik.com/guide/gfut5-e.pdf

You can either "save as..." or open in in a window.
I think the important part is to have DIP switch 1 set to 1 and 2 set to 0.
I believe my settings are:
switch 1 - 1
switch 2 - 0
switch 3 - 1
switch 4 - 0
switch 5 - 1
switch 6 - 1

hope that helps...

[BLK]

Thanks Andy, I'll give it a try tomorrow. Thanks a lot for the manual. Hope this will do it because we are supposed to get some bad weather later this week, and I'd like to at least get this thing movin before then. Once again, thanks for the help!

BK

[BJMFH]

I just received my second brushless setup today.

This time I decided to go with the 5300/ 4018 combo. I definately won't be leaving the batteries connnected to this one unless I'm using it.

I'm driving a FT TC3 this time. I'm looking for advice on where to mount the speed controller. Also what are some good gear ratios to run? Thank you!

[Soya v1.1]

Suggested gearing:

[BJMFH]

That looks like a 34 tooth pinion gear. I'm sure you enjoy the smell of burning motors, but I do not. Thank you anyway.

A word on the 4018, this thing is the biggest piece of fu*king sh*t ever! I'm getting rid of this cogging bast*rd and buying a Hacker ESC. The 5300 motor seems pretty decent though.

[fReShJiVe]

Originally posted by BJMFH
I just received my second brushless setup today.

This time I decided to go with the 5300/ 4018 combo. I definately won't be leaving the batteries connnected to this one unless I'm using it.

I'm driving a FT TC3 this time. I'm looking for advice on where to mount the speed controller. Also what are some good gear ratios to run? Thank you!

I'm running a FDR of 8.2-8.5 with 5300/schulze58ce...around 8mins race time with unmatched 3000HV ...tried lower than 8 and it seems to be thermal zone

[Lord Radeon]

Mr. Constructor: For someone who talks a lot about BL, your a crackpot if you think you can run two BL motors on one BL esc. It doesn't work :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[RadicalRustler]

have you tried it lord radeon? cause if it gives a certain amount of amps, then the motors have to be under it. so two basic 2100's (i think) might work on an warrior 7018

[Soya v1.1]

Originally posted by BJMFH
I'm sure you enjoy the smell of burning motors, but I do not. Thank you anyway.

Burning motors? I think that's the smell of how much weed you've been smoking. And it does work. My bolink cracked 50 before it hit a curb.

[SteveK]

I came in late: Can somebody give me a quick run-down of the last 1,567 posts? Thanks.

[RadicalRustler]

Hey, you visited!

[SteveK]

Well 1500 posts is a little much to weed through. I always tried to keep regular forums I ran on the HPI board to 50 posts (Mini R/C cars before the Mini-Z was out, scale models, and full-scale rally stuff). Made it much easier to read and keep track of.

[RadicalRustler]

you guys go to aveox lately? they have sensorless motors and controllers now.

[BJMFH]

Originally posted by Soya v1.1
Burning motors? I think that's the smell of how much weed you've been smoking. And it does work. My bolink cracked 50 before it hit a curb.

I wasn't trying to d*ck a dude. I just thought that you were playing a joke on a newbie like me. I've never even heard on anyone gearing their motor that high. Most guys I talk to say that anything above 26 teeth will burn out your motor, and that's on a stock motor. They say never go higher than 23 teeth on a mod. Now that I know you were serious, I'll give it a try. If I did offend you, I do apologize, it certainly was not my intention.

A word on my "weed smoking". I'm on probation right now so there isn't any of that going on. I have to haul my a*s down to the community corrections center every time my color or letter gets called. It sucks!

[SteveK]

Is there a brushless motor out there that has about the same power output as a Mabuchi 540 or a Traxxas Stinger or mild stock motor? I'm looking for the advantages of a BL (How did it get 'BL' as an abbreviation: Isn't 'brushless' one word? It should really be BM for brus.... well, maybe not.) without the massive power output. I normally use 20+ turn motor for long run time and low upkeep, and I'm also not a speed monger and prefer torque over RPM.

[WheelNut]

A low power brushless system? Don't hear about people looking for that to often! Novak's new brushless system will have a lower power mode, along with higher powered ones also. So if you wanna go slow for a while you can, and if you wanna go fast you can. Or you could check out some 400 sized motors, those might work good, I dunno. :confused:

[yf22k]

You can always just dial down the throttle atv...you never know when you might need that extra power:)

[Lord Radeon]

RR, your missing the point. a 4 million amp rated controller couldn't power two motors. It's in the basic principle of the brushless' design. the controller has to energize/deenergize the electromagnetic poles inside the motor. The controller is constantly keeping track of the poles in the motor, and when it cant keep up, or loses track of the shaft via the poles, it cogs (cogging). When it gets back in track, its smooth again. One controller can't keep track of two individual sets of poles, its just not possible because the shafts/magnets in the two different motors will always be in different positions relative to each other

[SteveK]

I thought about trying a smaller 380 or 400 size airplane motor, but I don't know how the BL circuits work, like could a car ESC use one of those motors.

The reason I want less power is because I have mostly small areas in which to run, and like I said, I'm not a speed monger, so a mild stock motor for open spaces or a Stinger or Mabuchi 540 is good for small spaces or slow running with my Pajero or something.

What's the cheapest I can get out of it for an ESC, and what's a good smaller motor?

[RadicalRustler]

why don't you get a stinger? that would work. and a lot cheaper.

for the speed issue, novaks/orions should be good. And on the way the esc's work, the esc has to send each wire a separate voltage (since its wires are on the can (not the tiolet) and the magnets are on the pole in the middle.) with sensored motors, a sensor is on the end measuring where the magnets are, and causes very little friction and limits rpm. On sensorless, the esc sends a signal to the wires to figure out where the magnets are and a slow/cheap esc will do it slow enough to be noticed by a human. it only coggs from full standstill/reverse. the sensorless motors also have an rpm limit, but has to be done using rpms/volt and redlining. (usually around 50000-70000 for 540 sized motors, below goes up to around 100000max. if the redline is over, then the motor may throw a magnet, and your motor is toast.

[jkoppk]

SteveK----------

I'm not sure what you want to spend but I know the Hacker B50s series of brushless motors come in a wide power range from the 6s to the 27s or higher.for the motor and 18:61 controller your looking at about $350.

[Lord Radeon]

RR you don't have the slightest clue what your talking about. Have you ever taken your motor (though i seriously doubt it) apart? Do you even understand the innards of the motors themselves? There are no magnets to throw. The RPM limits are the limits of the bearings, and of the switching capabilities of the controllers themselves. As for the controllers working, that's correct. Now think about that, and you'll get your own answer as to why you can't use two motors with one controller.

[andy497]

Umm...last time I checked, my brushless had a magnet assembly spinning around in the center... Heh, they're not full of empty space.

As far as running two motors off one esc, I can understand your reasoning why it wouldn't work, but my schulze manual specifically
mentions it. It says they don't recommend it but it's possible. Take that with a grain of salt I guess.

[Lord Radeon]

Oh its very possible. It just doesn't work. I think your taking what I mean too literally. When I say it doesn't work, I mean it doesn't work with any level of performance. The motors just can't say in sync with each other. Runs like crap. Your better off with one motor or two controllers.

And andy: Yes, but generally the magnet is a part of the shaft. The lehner motors I use cannot 'throw' a magnet in the sense your talking. Beyond them, I have no knowledge... perhaps others can. If I could get on maxxtraxx I could link to a pic of Kraeuterbutter's showing the magner assemblies

[OptimaMan]

Steve K:
To answer you question... Yes, just get a Hacker C50 motor with a higher wind... get a 14 turn or something. That'll give you only 2600 rpm per volt. Keep the speed relatively low, but it will have ton's of torque. When I say "low speed", I'm talking about 20 mph. (the 8 turn which has 4600 rpm/volt gives me about 35 mph on my touring car). Of course gearing will have a huge impact on top speed blah blah and more blah, but if you stick with a high turn motor and gear it down, it'll be perfect for driving around in a small tight spot... probably for over 30 minutes too.

[Prinler]

I just ran my Brushless C50 motor on my Maxx. New Cvd's new alum chassis, Idlers...... 2 Runs and i think i broke the stock sliders and the front Diff.... :( Oh well its good. Not as Fast as i expected. but Fast.

[RadicalRustler]

lord radeon, do YOU know how they work? b/c the smaller motors have a higher redline limit yet they have smaller bearings. The rotational mass caused by the larger magnets is enough to somehow destroy the solid piece of the magnet.

For stevek the lehner 2100/2400 should be in your speed range, but it will have lots of torque (more winds, more torque, just like a 'normal' motor.) or a 15 series. Both are made by lehner. Or you could look at www.gm-racing.de and there speed commander/evo one.

[andy497]

Got a question about how people are setting up their packs.

My manual specifically says to keep your packs assembled as stick (and not side by side) to keep the total length of wire between controller and cells down.

They also give some ridiculously short maximum length allowed between the ends of the pack and the esc. (I think max length was 4 inches and the leads out of the esc were already about 3.5). I did keep all my leads as short as possible. I got a new pack though with long leads and it doesn't seem to create any problem when I run it (e.g. doesn't overheat and runtimes are about the same).

Anyhow, I'd really like to reassemble my packs to side by side so they sit lower in the car and so I can equalize the cells when discharging. Has anybody run their brushless both ways and know of a big difference?


One more thing while I think of it. Does anybody know of a source where they detail the power output of their motors. Like, how do b50s and c50s compare for example. And no, I'm not talking about rpm/volts. I can accommodate rpms with different gearing, I'm really talking about total power (torque * rpm) output per input voltage. Some manufacturers give watts I guess, except you don't know what the input voltage was to get that. I don't care if a motor produces gobs of power at 32 cells when I want to run it on 6.

[JonDax]

Andy,

I don't remember which esc you have, but I have the 58ce and I use side-by-sides, and they are much more fun than stick packs! Way more punch on my setup, and my car is much better balanced.

My esc also has about a 3.5" wire on it, and my side-by-sides have about the stock length of a deans premade pigtail. I also ended up making the leads from the esc to motor a little longer than recommended, but no problems so far. I figure a little extra wire length and good placement of batteries and esc was more important than keeping the wires short. If you use a good quality 13 or heavier wire I'm sure you'll be fine. I used Deans Ultrawire throughout.
--JD

[BLK]

Can someone post a pic of how they arranged thier esc in a tc3? I know that I have seen pics before, but I can seem to locate them on this thread. Anyway, I am in the process of installing/working out the kinks in my 5300/18.61 setup and there is no where for the esc to fit nicely. Also, I have a the new Futaba 3PK radio (I think that is the model number) which is FM/PCM. Some peeps have written about trouble with interference between the digital receiver/servos and the esc's. Anyone found a way around it? I'd really like to use the radio, but not if its going to give me yet another BL headache!

Thanks,
BK

[ViciousKnives]

i've read around the first 10-11 pages of this thread so far. Anyway, i'm pretty much a noob. i'm not new to r/c cars, but when i started, i was pretty young and didn't really read up on things that much (that was about 9-10 years ago). so, i'm getting back into the hobby, and things are making more sense now that i'm older.

anyway, i just got a tc3, and i'm wondering what a good brushless setup would be for around $250. currently i'm running a brushed set up with a 12t hand wound and an older 610-rv esc (anyone heard of it?? it's like from 1992 lol) right now i'm looking at a Lehner #5300 Basic or #4200 and the Lehner Warrior 7018 or 4018 for a controller. i'm looking to gear my car so i can get around 40-50mph and at least 8 minutes of runtime on a 6 cell 2400 pack, although i might make an 8 cell pack if i can figure out how to fit the darn thing in. oh yeah, and will i need a receiver pack?? because right now, the controller looks pretty huge and i barely have any room in my chassis as it is with just a regular brushed set up.

if anyone has some other recommendations for a tc3 brushless set up for $250 or under, i'm all ears.

thanks in advance

[andy497]

Jon: that is good to hear. I'm pricing match 3000s and 3300s now, and I'd sure like to go side by side.

BLK: I have an 18.61/5300 in a xxx-4, which is somewhat like a tc3 I guess. (driveshaft/belt running through center) I run my esc on top of the battery, which is what I think most people are doing. There just isn't room on the motor side. That does leave space there for a small rx batt if you need one though. It's not the prettiest solution, but it works ok.

Vicious: for that price range, a lehner motor and lehner/schulze esc is probably going to be your best bet. I would start by looking at rumrunners.com and finedesignrc.com
Both have good stuff and good prices.

[tc3punk]

blk, you want' pics of controllers on TC3's?

why not go to the tc3 site!?!?:confused:

Tc3.1dumb.com (http://www.tc3.1dumb.com) ;)

well, I havn't updated it in about a month, but when I get my DSL back up, I'll be hosting from my pc, so it'll have LOTS more info

gl:D

[OptimaMan]

ViciousKnives:

I have a touring car also (XXXS graphite +). Presently I'm using a Lehner Basic 5300 with a Schulze 12.97. Using any kind of gearing etc... with 6 cells, you'll NEVER reach 50 mph.. You might just scratch 40 mph on a big oval with some big pinions. Also, on a large oval, you'll probably get around 8 minutes of run time on 3300s.

For a recommendation, the Lehner Basic 5300 is a great motor for the price. They are going for 120 or so. I've actually read all these pages and people seem to have problems with the Lehner Warrior controllers so stay away from them (cogging problems). I personally own two controllers - the Schulze and a Hacker Master Car Sport model. Both work great, but unfortunately, the Hacker is 200 bucks and the Schulze is like 270 bucks. This takes you out of your budget, but I think it's the only way to go. They're practical because they both have BEC (not that much space on a TC). The Hacker controller you'll have to really look for a place to mount because of the size. The Schulze, because it's so thin, can be heatshrinked right on the battery hold down bar. You'll need to find a way to balance the car left/right however (or just not care - that's my way).

If you go with a Lehner 5300, you'll be presently surprised, but don't expect unworldly power. Like I said, you'll be lucky to be doing 40 with 6 cells.

I was thinking of going to a Hacker C40 6 turn, but somebody recommended that I stay away from them - problems? Somebody told me they're rewiring the 6 turn or something. Anybody else hear anything about this motor?

[andy497]

Yeah, optima, I'm looking at the hacker c40 6t too. I'd like to know how it compares to the b40 (or is it b50). My 5300 is hot, but not extreme track-burning hot. In fact, they just re-worked my track for the high-end modifieds, and the brushed 9-10t single D5s (I think, can't remember quite which winding they are running) are clearing jumps that I am not. Sigh... I still have some timings and such that I can play with, but I might just have to go to a bigger motor to 1 up them.

[WheelNut]

SteveK-Check out the basic motor with less the less than 4200 ratings, like the basic 3100. That might have the low power/long run time your looking for in a normal size.Lehner bsaic series (http://www.rumrunnerhobbies.com/basic_series.htm)

[ViciousKnives]

well, since 6 cells won't be enough, what i've been considering (which might sound retarded, but i'm a noob) is ripping appart three six cell 2400 packs (unmatched since i'm a cheapo) and re-soldering them into two 9 cell packs. i'm thinking this wouldn't be a good idea since they're all unmatched, but they're all the same brand packs and i figure it would hardly matter since everything is unmatched. i figure putting unmatched with unmatched of the same brand won't make a difference.

ok, so with a 9 cell setup. oh yeah, and i heard with the warrior escs, you just need to add a receiver pack and turn up your throttle trim a bit and you won't notice the cogging. i'd rather stay below $300 now if at all possible, but i don't want to invest good money in something and end up having to buy again. like they say, buy cheap and you buy twice... so, with 9 cells and the 5300 think i'll be able to get around 40-45mph at least??

oh yeah, and anyone got any ideas on how to fit all of this on a tc3 chassis??

1. 9 cells (i'm thinking of sticking one in the foam insert place, and then the other two on top of the battery holder)

2. a receiver pack since it'll probably be necessary

3. the controller since the brushless controllers look quite huge.

also, i think i might get some servo tape and just mount my receiver on to of my servo to make more room.

[ViciousKnives]

oh yaeh, and my whole goal is to smoke a tc3 nitro (not on the track just out in some parking lots) and an RS4 Super Nitro.

the tc3 nitro is stock.

the RS4 Super nitro has a two speed tran, and a header and exhaust kit.

[k_sw31]

Well, if your aiming for the 50 + mark then you'll probably have to go a little over your budget, but you'll have high quality equipment.

I suggest you go for a hacker B50 8s and a Schulze 18.61 combo. It would be a total of around 370$, but you'll have an awesome setup with high quality equipment.

I would go this way (if i myself had the money, and were shootin for 50 mph ):rolleyes: because first of all, the basic series motors wern't designed to go over 8 cells, and weren't really ment for super high speed runs. The B50 series are designed to do around 12 cells, and just take cars up to higher speeds in general (even if they were originally designed for airplanes, go figure :p). So wiht a B50 you could safley run 9 cells (atleast) and gear up some more because you will have a lot more torque than a basic would otherwise. With the schulze you'll have great off the line performance and more tunability, anda warrior wouldn't be able to take the much motor (i think).

So just go about 70 $ over your budget ( :rolleyes: ) and you'll roast your two friends :D

[Prinler]

Schulze doesnt even warentee there stuff. I hear alot that Schulze wont repair stuff. If you smoke your ESC before you even more an inch. better suck in the smoke cause it that all ya get for your money. they want crazy money to fix it. I know chris Fine has nothing but troubles getting them to fix even stuff they know is there fault.


The Hacker ESC Isnt good for instant power. Pull the trigger and it takes a min before it goes. Its sad. One think i miss about the stock motors is when you pull the trigger it goes. The Brushless you pull and pray. :p Even with a RX pack. Its slow to accelerate. Once you get it going. It powers my C50 ok. The way people talk about brushless is like they make your things do light speed. When people buy them, they are disapointed. I think i will just get a 1950 lehner and 18 cells on my maxx. Maybe i can get it to explode.

[ViciousKnives]

ok, what if i went with a hacker motor either B50 S6 or S7 and the Lehner Warrior 7018 for a speed controller? seeing as how huge these things are, i think i'm probably only gonna be running 7 or 8 cells max since i'll probably have problems getting all this stuff to fit in a tc3 chassis.

oh yeah, and that stuff that i wanted to do with my batts in the previous posts, could i do that? or would that be a bad thing to do?

[ViciousKnives]

how about this set up? Aveox will run me around 325 or so. An RC7 motor with a L160RC controller. sorry if i'm posting a whole lot, but i'd like to have something to fiddle around with by the time my spring break rolls around, which is the first month of march.

btw, how do you guys fit all this stuff in the chassis of a touring car?? with the emaxx, buggies, and trucks it doesn't seem to be as much of a problem since they have much larger chassis, but i'm still wondering how to get this all in a TC3 together with 8-9 cells. 7 cells would be no prob, but anything more seems like it'll be a problem.

[Soya v1.1]

Originally posted by k_sw31
I suggest you go for a hacker B50 8s and a Schulze 18.61 combo. It would be a total of around 370$, but you'll have an awesome setup with high quality equipment.

That's the setup I have! Yay!:D

[OptimaMan]

Aveox's RC7 doesn't have the RPM to really go fast. If you really want to beat your buddies, you'll have to go with a Hacker motor (my opinion). The Basic 5300 is nice, but a small motor. I'm not sure of this, but the Hacker C40 I believe is a smaller motor than the B50 series. Yes, they're both "540" size or something... but the C-40 has cooling fins that make it 540 while the B50 is ALL MOTOR.

So, for super horsepower and RPM, go with a B50 motor with 6 or 7 turn. According to their charts, they have a 5 turn also which has over 7000 rpm/volt - but thay might fry your controller. Get the 6 turn. Stick with 7 cell (Gold Peaks recommended) and get yourself a nice Schulze controller or Hacker Master Sport. I don't get cogging effects at all with Schulze or the Hacker Master Sport for car. With the correct gearing, you should easily get 45 maybe 50 mph. Nice thing is, you'll get to that speed in less than 2 seconds (assuming you have nice tires). If you want to go to like 9 or more cells, then get the 8 turn. With 12 cells and the 8 turn motor, you'll surely BLOW away those nitro TCs. (You might just blow up your car too).

To address the spacing issues... stick to 7 cells and it'll fit stock. Leave the receiver and servo where it's supposed to be. If you get the Hacker esc, just put that on top of the servo. If you get a Schulze esc, the servo tape doesn't stick to it so you have to shrink wrap it onto the battery hold down bar. Like I said earlier, the car will be out of balance, but a little tweaking of the springs on the heavier side and it'll work just fine for street bashing against buddies.

I have a picture of my car on this thing. It's on the 58th page of this "forum".

[ViciousKnives]

ok, so i think i'm gonna go with the hacker c40 motor (probably 7 turn). i saw it for around $180. with tax, that'll be around 195. so, i'm willing to spend around $135 more bucks or so. that'll bring me to $330-340. ouch, this is gonna be painful, but i figure my 12t handwound core modified won't last that long anyway. i'd rather buy once than fifthy million times.

btw, how bad are the warrior controllers?? are they THAT bad? how would it be if i used the c40 with the 70amp warrior? i really don't want to put $200 down for a controller, and if i burn it out, i'm screwed...

btw, what kind of gearing would you guys recommend if i got a 7t c40 and used 7 cells (possibly 6)?

oh yeah, and can i use unmatched batt packs with this stuff and just change the connectors to deans??

[spenzalii]

So, what motor/controller combo would anyone recommend for 12 cells in a pan car, like the RC10L03 Touring car? I may sell out and just get the Novak for my XXX-S (the max on that will be 7 cells, and it's just for convenience) and get the real setup for the nitro killer.

[RadicalRustler]

to vk
from what you gatter here after being in from page 36 (stevek, soon you'll be saying you were lucky to come in at the 63.) it seems a reciever pack cures almost all of the problems of cogging. more cells help too. like you could go 7 cell in a tc3.

[RadicalRustler]

spenzalii, is it nitro's you intend to kill? or is it people.? cause a 12 cell bl pan is gonna be like a, a, a, auhh, works fail me. :p

Motor, c50. controller, shulze 18.61 w/ reciever pack.

[RadicalRustler]

ohoh, for the panner/killer kinfe, get a 2280 and a controller for 24cells. just pile them up on each other and kill the record. and get some good charger. it will take 4 packs and like 5 minute run time.
p.s. the 2280 is 800g and delivers 3000-4000watts.

[BLK]

Originally posted by tc3punk
blk, you want' pics of controllers on TC3's?

why not go to the tc3 site!?!?:confused:

Tc3.1dumb.com (http://www.tc3.1dumb.com) ;)

well, I havn't updated it in about a month, but when I get my DSL back up, I'll be hosting from my pc, so it'll have LOTS more info

gl:D

Thats what I'm talkin about!!!! I was looking for the site the other day, but I couldn't pull it up for some reason. I thought maybe it was down. Glad to see it is still up and running. Thanks a million for the link!!!

BK

[tc3punk]

yeah, it was prolly down when you tried, cause on my netfirms account, I host my avatars and signatures for all the forums I go to

and then when I post links, it gets' alot of visits

if I post pictures directly on a forum, the site almost immediatly goes down:rolleyes: :mad:

so when I get my DSL, the site will be able to have 100mb + vids and such:D but it'll have a slower upload than most:(
but it's worth it I think

oh yeah, no banners!:p

I'm not sure how many of you visit the maxxtraxx forums, but there's been a bunch of people that have had Lehner and Schulze controllers fail on them (some just from pluging the batteries in:mad: ) and most people agree with the following:

DO NOT BUY SCHULZE OR LEHNER CONTROLLERS RIGHT NOW. stick with Hacker for controllers, until the warenty info gets straightend out. there have been people that have had to pay $200+ to replace their SCHULZE controller, that smoked as soon as the batteries were pluged in. Lehner on the other hand has had problems with getting replacements to people any quicker than 2-3 months. People are getting mad at Rumrunnerhobbies and FineDesignRC, because of the wait time / cost to replace them, but there just the distributers, and can't control how fast a controller get's back to the customer and why controllers are all of a sudon going up in smoke.

I've heard bad things about Hacker Master Car controllers, but it was mainly that they were just not as smooth as Hacker had claimed:rolleyes:
----------

as for the L3, I'd throw a 1930/5 with a Hacker Master Car controller in it with 10-12 cells, and gear it to the moon:D

gl

[Prinler]

Amen I hate the idea of payung to fix a controler. its not like its made of glass or something. I should be able to be attacked to a truck that can drop off a 2 story building. And still work. And not just Pffft up in smoke. I had my Warrior for like 2days and when i woke up the next day it just wouldnt work. Its those green Gremlins at night, they like to come out and mess with me. I will aggree on the Jedi controlers from Hacker. I have yet to have one problem. Not only that they LOOK like a Regular controler. Just wish the prices would come down. I would buy another controler if i could aford it.

[ViciousKnives]

ok, well i found a great deal here http://www.fxaeromodels.com/Motors/escs.htm they have a Motor w/Hacker Master 40-3P Heli bundle for $275 and many other hacker motor/controller bundles for cheaper than i've seen anywhere else.

any input on these would be great. thanks

[spenzalii]

I'd throw a 1930/5 with a Hacker Master Car controller

Who makes and where?

Motor, c50. controller, shulze 18.61 w/ reciever pack.

Any particular turn you recommend? and will the 50 fit? I thought it was a bit larger than a c40.

As far as the nitro killer, lets just say I want to sic my mongoose on a few serpents when the spring thaw hits around here. So I'll take my time and research that for the best around.

The Novak is strickly for play; when it goes down, I'll put my P94 back in there

[tc3punk]

1930/5 = Lehner
Lehner + distributing = Rumrunnerhobbies.com

:o

[ViciousKnives]

ok, well i'm about to head to my LHS right now since i need some real allen wrenches (just stripped the head on a a screw... bleh), motor oil lube, and possibly some screws.

i think i'll put the body on my tc3 now. stupid me, i've been running it without the body for the past 3-4 weeks now. quite lucky i haven't flipped it or broken anything.

i'll see what they recommend.

[k_sw31]

I'm bored, look at my pede all setup, just waitin for my controller :)

[tc3punk]

still gonna use tuperware (C) (TM) to hold the cont. and rec.?:rolleyes:

[ViciousKnives]

wow, nice k_sw31.

oh yeah, if you could give me some input on this. Hacker C40-10S with a Hacker Master 40-3P Heli controller. i can get this combo for $275 right now. any word on this from anyone would be greatly appreciated. thanks.

[tc3punk]

eh I'm not familiar with hacker controllers, so I'm not sure what you should do

if it's called heli controller, wouldn't that make it for helis?

some controllers like that don't have brakes (:rolleyes: )


brushless isn't cheap at the start...
but once you've had it for a year, it'll be cheaper than running brushed....

I'd go hacker master car sport and a c40....

gl:)

[ViciousKnives]

actually, hacker has the controller on their site. http://www.hackerbrushless.com/controllers.shtml

oh blah... no breaks. bleh... guess that one is no good. jeez, i just really want to go with lehner controllers now. i can't tell what i should buy for a controller now, since everyone seems to have contradicting info/recommendations.

for the motor, i'll probalby go with a hacker c40 for sure now (especially since it'll be easy to mount into my tc3), but i'm really lost as to what i should get for a controller. if the problems with the lehner warrior controllers is that they cog, but that it can be fixed with a receiver pack, then i think i might just go with the lehner controllers. if not, how do aveox controllers work with the hacker c40?

[k_sw31]

Go for either a hacker master sport or a schulze 18.61, in the long run it is best, even if you fo need to spend an extra week or two saving money :)

[tc3punk]

VK, I have a vid, of a lehner 4200 with a Hacker master car sport on 10 cells....

in a tc3

if you want to see it, contact me

Y!: AFNufan
AIM: AFNufan
MSN: tc3punk@hotmail.com
ICQ: 129052997

you might lean twards the basic series motors after you see the vid

you have been warned :D

[ViciousKnives]

looks like i'm gonna have to donate more blood... :D

i don't have a job, :( ... i just work as a lab rat at my school and get $30-40 a week for donating 9ccs of blood twice a week. hehehe. it's pretty ghetto, but it works. yeah, i guess i'll just have to go with that. btw, how big is the darn thing?

[tc3punk]

how big is what darn thing?:confused:

the motor?

it's the same size as a normal brushed motor (540 I thinky)

are you gonna IM me any time soon?

cause I'm on 56k, and it'll prolly take like a half hour to get sent

but I'm about to go to bed, so if you catch me, I'll be able to send it to you while I sleep:p

gl:)

[k_sw31]

The basic series motors are very small, like, imagine take a brushed motor, cut the endbell and comm off, and thats about how long they are, and the diameter is a little less than average :)

[tc3punk]

woah!

news to me...:rolleyes:

well, I knew it wasn't any bigger than a brushed motor:p

[ViciousKnives]

actually, the thing i was referring to was the controller. how big is the controller?

oh yeah, and the thing with the basic series, chances are that i'll only be running 6-7 cells, 9 max if i can figure something out. and i don't plan on spending money on matched packs. i'm just going to cut appart all my crappy stick packs (assuming they're all the same brand cells).

if i'm going to spend, i want to make sure i can beat my bro's rs4 super nitro.

oh yeah, and what kind of run time will i get with a hacker c40 and with a basic 5300 or basic 4200. ideal run time would be around 10 minutes or more if at all possible, while still retaining the top speed of around 40-50mph (not the whole time of course).

[k_sw31]

The controller, with the BL stuff, the controllers aren't that thick, but really long and wide, like, my warrior 70 was only a centimeter thick but like 2x3 inches.

But with teh hacker master car, i think it is really big anyways.


I still think a B50 or C40 is the way to go, with an 18.61 :)

[RadicalRustler]

the speed commander from gm is better than the hacker car b/c it has 512 steps to the 300 the hacker has. And it seems to be smaller. Same price. Longer wait.

[ViciousKnives]

well, i just ordered my brushless motor. i guess it'll be here in like 2-4 weeks

[k_sw31]

Originally posted by RadicalRustler
the speed commander from gm is better than the hacker car b/c it has 512 steps to the 300 the hacker has. And it seems to be smaller. Same price. Longer wait.

And almost absoloutley no product support................

[k_sw31]

Originally posted by ViciousKnives
well, i just ordered my brushless motor. i guess it'll be here in like 2-4 weeks

What setup did you get?

[ViciousKnives]

i just decided to go with lehner since it's cheaper, and i talked to a few guys online who were currently using lehner setups with 8-9 cells and i saw videos too, which were satisfying enough.

besides, i really don't need THAT much power now that i think about it. and i don't want to spend $200 on just a controller.

so, i got the lehner 5300 basic, and the warrior 7018

[ViciousKnives]

the other thing, a good number of guys have said they've burned out their c40s (one burnt out two of them).

[Prinler]

I was disapointed. I was told with the C50 i would have to much power. I could flip it if i pulled to hard even if i was going 30 mph if i still pulled it ... it would flip. I cant even Flip it from a standstill.

$400 to have less low end then my stock motors :(

Maybe it will get better when i put CVD's on my front. I was Told i didnt need them. Thats retarded. They stripped out really fast. Also think i striped both Diffs. Hate it when my CC's get full :(

[BJMFH]

I agree, brushless has definately let me down also. It's certainly not the huge nitro killer it was cracked up to be; unless you hook the motor up to 12 cells making the car useless except for speed runs. You can plug 10 cells into a regular 12 turn and the thing will have crazy speed too. Big f*cking deal!

Yeah, I suppose the lack of maintence and longer run times are great. The way people are talking about brushless on this site is crazy. You people had me believing that brushless had all this untamed, vicious, power. I thought that when I strapped the gear into my car the thing would be smoking the tires, twisting the chassis, and topping out at 80 mph with plenty of room for taller gearing. Oh it smoked it alright, after the esc blew up because I made the fatal "mistake" of leaving my batteries connected after running it. There was a lot a smoke in that regard, so I guess brushless does have the power to burn my car after all. What a load of bullsh*t Nazi propaganda!

Who here actually runs their car with more than 12 cells anyway (emaxx and 1/8 scale excluded)? I've strapped 12 cells into my car and the thing handled like a f*cking barge. Sure it was plently fast, but stopping was akin to halting a train. Forget about turning as well. Brushless can be fast if you have a million batteries.

I'm almost positive that most of us here run their rc's with 6-7 cells. Just trying drag racing a nitro car with a two speed transmission and see how far your 6 cell battery pack gets you. I've seen brushless cars running against nitro cars on indoor tracks and win. Those tracks were designed for 1/10 scale electric racers, they aren't big enough for nitro cars to stretch their legs. Brushless is much faster off the line than nitro is, but try racing your BL on a real gas track and see who gets lapped.

I tried the 4018 to replace my Master Sport, but that turd coggs so much that it isn't even worth the effort. My car is already has enough electric equipment, I'll be d*mned if I put a receiver pack on board too. The only reason I don't go nitro is because I hate maintenence.

In case you people can't tell, I'm f*cking wasted right now and really pissed. My girlfriend would'nt put out and I just ordered the Hacker Competition ESC, setting me back another 300 bucks. This has just been a really sh*tty day. I'm going to pass put now and wake up with a huge headache, oh joy! :mad:

[ViciousKnives]

hold on, you sort of hate brushless, and yet you just bought a $300 controller from hacker??? either i'm lost or you really are wasted...

[ViciousKnives]

oh yeah, does anyone know what kind of mods i'd need to make to my tc3 so it can handle the power of a brushless?

right now, i just have the basic tc3 racer kit. will i have to replace cvds, and so on??

[Soya v1.1]

Originally posted by Prinler
I was disapointed. I was told with the C50 i would have to much power. I could flip it if i pulled to hard even if i was going 30 mph if i still pulled it ... it would flip. I cant even Flip it from a standstill.

$400 to have less low end then my stock motors :(

If you can't flip it from a standstill, you might want to check your gearing. Mine would flip over backwards and forwards when braking.

[Soya v1.1]

Originally posted by BJMFH
You can plug 10 cells into a regular 12 turn and the thing will have crazy speed too. Big f*cking deal!

Sure you could, then see how long the motor will last:rolleyes:

[JonDax]

Originally posted by Soya v1.1
If you can't flip it from a standstill, you might want to check your gearing. Mine would flip over backwards and forwards when braking.

I agree. It sounds like you might be overgeared. Have you checked the Hacker site and tried the recommended spur gear? It sounds like stock gearing is no good for the C50. Seriously, lower gears on a brushless will get you more speed than a tall gear. Really!:)
--JD

[k_sw31]

Yeah, you can always hook a brushed motor up to 10 cells, but then see how long your comm and brushes last before then burn or arc to death. :mad: I know that, I only ran 10 1500 cells on my speed gems pro, the brushes were so fkin burnt it wasn't even funny :mad:

[tc3punk]

Brushless is much faster off the line than nitro is, but try racing your BL on a real gas track and see who gets lapped.

eh, brushless can EASILY beat a nitro on any track, if it's a big enough motor

but you'd be spending big $$ to get there

Occifer (from mxtx boards) raced his TC3 with a 1930/5 and 18150 on 7 cells, and was lapping the nitro TC's he was racing

that was on an out door track for nitro
but, about 7 minutes in, the car had died
seems the tc3 couldn't handle the power:rolleyes:

brokey:
front diff melted
all 4 cvd's had broke
center shaft had started to twist

but with a normal brushless (basic series) in a TC, you should be able to beat the other electrics that you race, with about 8 cells

and it doesn't have the torque to be melting diffs and snapping cvds, but it is alot torquey than a stock brushed;)

so, if you want to beat nitro's, get a more powerfull motor
if you want to beat elec., just about any BL will do:p

[BJMFH]

Alright, I apologize for my drunken, incoherent rambling last night. Looking back on my post I realize that most of what I wrote was complete bullsh*t.

I have hooked a brushed motor up to 10 cells before. The commuter is now permanently stuck to endbell and the brushes soddered themselves to the comm as well. But I was doing at least 60 before the motor finally gave up. The speed controller somehow survived though.

I don't know what type of track your buddy was lapping nitro on, but the times I've seen BL vs Nitro on a large gas track, nitro has almost always won. I'm not talking about racing against some sorry a*s bone stock NTC3. I'm talking about racing Serpents, Mugens, and Visions.

The 1930/5 is the cat's a*s of brushless motors huh? I'll have to look into getting one then. I would really like to beat nitro. It just sounds like I have the wrong stuff. I've got a 5300 and a B50 S8. The 5300 is good for running 6 cells on. I usually run more on the B50 S8. I have the 4018 ESC and I'll be getting the Hacker Competition some time this week. After my bank account recovers, I might pick up that Lehner motor you mentioned.

[Prinler]

I have the Recomended gearing for the maxx. It says 72/18 ... and guess what im running..... 72/18
No Flips.

[OptimaMan]

It could be your batteries. Cheap or old batteries have higher internal resistance and can't give that initial burst of power to flip the car back.

It could also be your controller. I don't know which one you have, but some have current limiters that are adjustable, some have software that give it a slightly slower smoother start, and some are just plain cheap and can't deliver instant on power.

[Soya v1.1]

Well then, try a 15T pinion.

[Prinler]

Im using the Hacker C50 and the Hacker Master Car Sport ESC. 72/18 and i have 2 GP3300 matched packs with huge numbers. and 10 2400 matched packs. I have 1/8th diff balls in my Slipper and it seems tight. I dont have a 15 tooth. I will buy one.

[k_sw31]

Ok, just got my BL controller, just waiting for a batt to charge now :D

[k_sw31]

WHOLY CRAP!! :D

YAY, I just ran the 5300/4018 setup on my pede wiht 19/87 gearing, and a sanyo 3000 hv sidexside pack, WHOLY ****! The god danged thing popped a wheelie at half throttle!!!!!! I have a 300 ft long drive way and that isn't enough to get up to speed safley :D

[k_sw31]

WHOLY CRAP!! :D

YAY, I just ran the 5300/4018 setup on my pede wiht 19/87 gearing, and a sanyo 3000 hv sidexside pack, WHOLY ****! The god danged thing popped a wheelie at half throttle!!!!!! I have a 300 ft long drive way and that isn't enough to get up to speed safley :D


THe only thing though, about only 1 minute into the run, I toasted something in the tranny, guess I'll get my T3 workin... :D

[Soya v1.1]

Good to hear it. Bet ya $1 it's the idler gear.
I bought a Sledgehammer off Ebay, should be here this week:D

[Prinler]

Idler gears suck. They should come in a hard composite or something. the light nylon breaks ez.


Sledge hammer? i think my friend has one... he got it at a Salvation army drop off :p

need it for parts? im sure he would give it up for cheep.

[k_sw31]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was the idler gear too, I may pick up an aluminum one...
too lazy to actually take the tranny apart, there are like 10 screws :p

I did get my T3 workin too, this thing is FRIGGIN FAST! I still haven't got it up to full speed but I'd estimate its doing around 40-45 :D

:)

[Soya v1.1]

Ya, there's some pretty big screws in the tranny. I used a drill with a screwdriver tip:p

[k_sw31]

Yay, I'm not the only one! :p

[JonDax]

Originally posted by Prinler
I have the Recomended gearing for the maxx. It says 72/18 ... and guess what im running..... 72/18
No Flips.

Dang, that's too bad. I was hoping to get an Emaxx this spring with the same motor, and was hoping it would blow doors off a stock Maxx, including killer wheelies. Maybe I'll still have to go nitro...
--JD

[Prinler]

Nitro is the way to go. :p
there is a sweet website showing a bunch of nitros, DANG they look fast!
http://trilordy.com/trivideo.html

[tc3punk]

if you have money, brushless will kill nitro

it's just a matter of how much you got in your wallet:rolleyes:


and now, people running bigger motors are having troubles with Lehner and Hacker controllers

hopefully everything will get worked out soon;)

[k_sw31]

I'm gonna make a vid of my T3 prinler, to prove how friggin fast this thing is going :D I popped a rx pack in also, now I can launch strait off the line :D

Oh yeah, my T3 kills compared to my Gt with a .12 cv-x :D

[tc3punk]

OMG@!!!! :eek:

and they call that basic:rolleyes: :p

now I have more of a fear of breaking drivetrain parts...
...as I wait impatiently for my 1930/5...

that vid was INSANE!

it sounded like it had high rpms when it wasn't even going 5mph

then when you touched teh throttle.... w000t!!!

[BJMFH]

I just got my Hacker Master Competition ESC today! Fine Design was kind enough to next day it.

This thing rules! There is no cogging at all. You can full throttle it from a standstill and it will light up your tires, no stuttering here. The ESC effortlessly transfers power to motor during the most demanding launches, even uphill. You want full throttle, you get full throttle. There is absolutely no hesitation at all.

I tried to get the thing to cog with pinion gears ranging from 18 to 34 teeth. I was only running 6 cells through my 5300 but the thing wouldn't cog under any of the conditions I put it through.

I really hate cogging! It reminds me of my first real car, a brown 1981 VW diesel Rabbit. This thing would cough, backfire, and stutter at any speed. The car had a choke for f*ck's sake! Whenever I see cogging it brings back painful memories of that POS. It's like a bull seeing red. Damn I f*cking hated that car!

I used to own the Master Sport. Both speed controllers are great but the Competition is superior. The Sport will hesitate slightly and sometimes stutter during a full throttle launch. The Sport is also not the smoothest during power slides and powered turns.

The Competition is better than any Novak ESC I've ever used.

The only problem I had with the Competition was installing it. I had to sand down the small ledge directly behind the motor of my FT TC3 in order to make it fit. If I'd had a smaller servo this wouldn't have been an issue. But I have a rather large KO digital FET servo that takes up alot of room.

I just like the way Hacker's Master ESCs look. I don't want some cheesy a*s shrink wrapped boat/plane speed controller in my ride. I want something with a heat sink that look like in belongs in an rc car.

I'm very happy with my new purchase! Now if only I could get a faster motor...

[yf22k]

hows the reverse and breaks on the hacker? that's a sensorless conroller right? I run my r/c in a parking lot and sometimes need reverse. the only problem is it takes a few seconds to go into reverse and i'm not used to it yet. I can light up all my tires and get them to squeal sometimes but the reverse just bugs me sometimes. is the hacker like that?

[k_sw31]

If anyone wants a vid of a basic in action lemme know... :D

[yf22k]

I'd like to see it:)

[k_sw31]

Sure, email me about it at K_Sw31@hotmail.com, and how big of a vid do you want? :)

[RCmaniac324]

WOW!

Hey guys, I haven't made a post in this thread in a while, but have kept up on it. Anyhoo, I was surfing the net, and decided to check Rumrunner's site to see if there were any interesting updates. Well, when I saw their homepage, I was stunned. Here's the copy-paste of what it says:

Updated Lehner-BK Speed Controllers
The new Lehner / BK controllers will be equip with some new features. Which include:



Advanced temperature sensing features (which will shutdown the controller before it overheats)

Cogging problems have been eliminated. (previously seen in certain RC Car applications)

AMP sensing software. (this will shutdown or stop the controller if it is exposed to higher than recommended amp loads)

Splash-poof protection is now available from the factory. (this can be added to any controller for a small charge upon request)

FREE - if you pay return postage your current Lehner / BK controller can be upgraded to include the above features for Free!

Email us for upgrading information!


New BASIC XL Motors Coming Soon!
Lehner has just produced a new XL version of the famous Basic motor. This motor is slightly larger than the standard Basic series motor and will offer high RPM & torque levels. They are designed for 10 to 12 cell setups, where the standard Basic series is designed for 6 to 8 cell setups. Pictures, pricing and additional information will be available in about a week. At that time we will start taking orders. Delivery is estimated for apx. March 7th!

I personally am gonna send in my Warrior to eliminate its cogging and improve these other features...wouldn't you? :D :p

[tc3punk]

well, good news for all you Lehner fans:D

go to RumRunnerHobbies (http://www.rumrunnerhobbies.com) for more info

here's what's said on RRH site:

Updated Lehner-BK Speed Controllers
The new Lehner / BK controllers will be equip with some new features. Which include:
--------------------------------------
Advanced temperature sensing features (which will shutdown the controller before it overheats)

Cogging problems have been eliminated. (previously seen in certain RC Car applications)

AMP sensing software. (this will shutdown or stop the controller if it is exposed to higher than recommended amp loads)

Splash-poof protection is now available from the factory. (this can be added to any controller for a small charge upon request)

FREE - if you pay return postage your current Lehner / BK controller can be upgraded to include the above features for Free!

Email us for upgrading information!
-------------------------
New BASIC XL Motors Coming Soon!
Lehner has just produced a new XL version of the famous Basic motor. This motor is slightly larger than the standard Basic series motor and will offer high RPM & torque levels. They are designed for 10 to 12 cell setups, where the standard Basic series is designed for 6 to 8 cell setups. Pictures, pricing and additional information will be available in about a week. At that time we will start taking orders. Delivery is estimated for apx. March 7th!

:)

[tc3punk]

LMAO!

I posted 2 min after yours, cause I'm on 56k, when I clicked new message, I didn't know you had posted that

lol:p

[RCmaniac324]

I see I'm not the only one who's excited.:D :p

[RCmaniac324]

Lol. Yea, Im on 56k too, so I know what it's like.:D :p

[tc3punk]

yeah, but this makes me kinda mad too:( :mad:

see I just ordered a 1930/5 and 18120 on the 18th of Jan. and it hasn't arived at my house yet

I'm not sure if it got to RRH yet, but if it did, I'll have to wait for it to go all the way back to Germany, to get updated, so I'll be another month till my car is running:mad:

unless, they knew that they were going to be updating the controllers, and fixed mine up before they sent it over to the states:rolleyes:

doubtfull, but I can hope right?

eh, but I guess it'll all be good in the end

gl:)

[BJMFH]

Originally posted by yf22k
hows the reverse and breaks on the hacker? that's a sensorless conroller right? I run my r/c in a parking lot and sometimes need reverse. the only problem is it takes a few seconds to go into reverse and i'm not used to it yet. I can light up all my tires and get them to squeal sometimes but the reverse just bugs me sometimes. is the hacker like that?



Yes, it is a sensorless controller.

There is about a 1/2 second delay on the Hacker's reverse from a moving stop (about 5-7 mph). From a full stop it will immediately reverse. From full throttle it will quickly brake, slow the car down, and reverse when it has reached a safe speed. Also, there is no time limit on the reverse. Some ESCs will only reverse for 5 seconds. The Hacker will reverse all day if you want it to.

The brakes are incredible. I can stop from about 45 mph in under 6 feet without locking up the wheels and turning the car sideways. The brakes will lock the wheels up if applied too hard, but that isn't always a bad thing. Say for example that I'm coming up on a curb too quickly, I can effectively lock the wheels up and perform a controlled powerside out of danger without spinning out or losing control.

It is an expensive ESC at 270, but more than worth it in my opinion. It has tons of settings (timing, frequency, forward only, current limiter) and you can't beat 90 amps continous and 120 peak for the money. Just don't leave the battery plugged in after you use it.

[ViciousKnives]

hey, tc3 punk, you think those new updates will take effect on the controller i just ordered. i ordered it on the first of february (at like 11pm or so) might have been the 2nd some time really early???


oh well, i can only hope. i would hate to have to send it back in. although i'm willing too.

[Prinler]

I Sent mine back to finedesign because it stoped on me. He told me that he would test it out and he would ship me a new one. He has a bunch comming from Germany ATM. Im hoping he is reciving the new ones!!!!! He still has yet to test the controler. Bah humbug.. been like 2 weeks :(

[BJMFH]

I just finished running 8 cells through my TC3. I now have to buy aluminum rims. My Hacker Competition and 5300 combo just ripped through my plastic rims like they were nothing. Or maybe that 34 tooth pinion gear was just too much. :D Any advice on how to mount the gear without meshing the spur too tightly would be appreciated. It fits, but just barely. Acceleration is still great.

The tires and rims were pre glued. The tire was the first thing to come lose, then the center of my plastic rim ripped free leaving behind a small piece of rim plastic still held in place by the locknut. It did this on 3 of 4 rims almost simultaneously.

Anyone else had these kind of problems? I figure aluminum rims will solve everything, I hope.

[AEcrazyT3]

OMG! Ripped the rims! I have got to go brushless!

[ViciousKnives]

how many teeth is your spur?? i'm thinking of doing 69 teeth on my spur and 33-35 on my pinion with the exact same setup you have except a so so controller (7018, i'm a cheapo... hehehe). so i'll have the same motor and amount of cells.

[yf22k]

I run hg aluminum wheels with my TB evo II brushless setup. With a normal brushed motor it takes a lot longer to accelerate and has shorter run time. with the brushless it doesn't matter at all!!! its great!

[k_sw31]

Prinler, you should know that I only got my controller back, and it is just a temporairy replaceement, I have been waiting since the end of September for my original one :eek:


It would be nice if once I get my original controller back if it were an updated one....

[AEcrazyT3]

Originally posted by Prinler
Nitro is the way to go. :p
there is a sweet website showing a bunch of nitros, DANG they look fast!
http://trilordy.com/trivideo.html

This Web Site Rocks! If you have not had a chance to check it out.. Do it NOW! Hope ya have hi speed internet though.. the movies are pretty big! Almost makes me want to go nitro.... Almost....

[AEcrazyT3]

Check out the toasty video on the above site! It has inspired me to by a fatty tc with a hot bl system!

[k_sw31]

To all planning on purchasing a Basic/Warrior setup:


Well, I have gotten two or three good runs in today, I'm gonna do one more in a little bit, and today is about 10 or 20 degrees warmer than the previous few days, and, my 4018 has started thermaling like crazy, basically, around 3-5 minutes into a run, it'll go into safe mode or whatever, and quite for a few seconds, then go, and quit, so I have to wait a few minutes for it to cool down, it is getting really annoying, so If anyone is buying a warrior, definatly go with the 7018, it is with 19/87 gearing and has been around 55 degrees. Hope this helps in someone's decision making process. :)


BTW- I did the time-how-long-it-takes-to-go-100 feet speed test, and here are my results-

1st run- about 37 mph
2nd- ~34 mph
3rd- ~45 mph :D
4th- ~40+ mph

And with my place to get speed up I never had the space to get up enough speed to top it out, and I was really short on stopping space too, so basically, the setup tops out at 45 mph (T3, 19/87 gearing, 6 HV Sanyo 3000's :D)

Gimme and extra cell or two and a bigger pinion and I can touch 50 :D

[RCmaniac324]

For those who wish to send thier controllers back ASAP for upgrade, I just got a reply to my E-mail I sent them...his first shipment of updgades is going out this coming monday. Ship it to this address by Monday with a brief note saying you would like it to be sent out to be upgraded :

Rum Runner Hobbies
c/o Donnie Wollard
815 N. Homestead Blvd. #235
Homestead, FL 33030

Hope this helps.:) . L8r.

[yf22k]

Originally posted by k_sw31
To all planning on purchasing a Basic/Warrior setup:


Well, I have gotten two or three good runs in today, I'm gonna do one more in a little bit, and today is about 10 or 20 degrees warmer than the previous few days, and, my 4018 has started thermaling like crazy, basically, around 3-5 minutes into a run, it'll go into safe mode or whatever, and quite for a few seconds, then go, and quit, so I have to wait a few minutes for it to cool down, it is getting really annoying, so If anyone is buying a warrior, definatly go with the 7018, it is with 19/87 gearing and has been around 55 degrees. Hope this helps in someone's decision making process. :)


BTW- I did the time-how-long-it-takes-to-go-100 feet speed test, and here are my results-

1st run- about 37 mph
2nd- ~34 mph
3rd- ~45 mph :D
4th- ~40+ mph

And with my place to get speed up I never had the space to get up enough speed to top it out, and I was really short on stopping space too, so basically, the setup tops out at 45 mph (T3, 19/87 gearing, 6 HV Sanyo 3000's :D)

Gimme and extra cell or two and a bigger pinion and I can touch 50 :D

I have a 7018 and 4200 setup lying around if anyone's interested

[BJMFH]

Originally posted by ViciousKnives
how many teeth is your spur?? i'm thinking of doing 69 teeth on my spur and 33-35 on my pinion with the exact same setup you have except a so so controller (7018, i'm a cheapo... hehehe). so i'll have the same motor and amount of cells.


I'm just running the stock spur gear, 72 teeth. Things are a bit tight, but it does fit. It just sounds a little bit louder because the gears are meshing a bit more tightly.

[fReShJiVe]

Originally posted by yf22k
I have a 7018 and 4200 setup lying around if anyone's interested
i'm interested in the esc but then again you wouldnt want to ship international:p

[yf22k]

heh yeah sorry...i'm working a deal with someone right now

[Prinler]

Maybe its just me. Maybe my batts suck.... Do integy GP3300's suck? how about my chargers? Super brain 959? Integy16x2? I dont get it guys. im hearing people with the basic series motors saying they are crazy fast with 6 cells. I get crazy fast in my t3 with 12 cells. Never 6. Its the equizenlent to a low mod motor. My friend and I both run Rs4 Pro 2's his has a Speeg gem 2 pro 13x2, mine is running 5300 with the hacker car SPORT ESC and GP3300's he has radio shack 2000's charged on a dial charger. We are both geared the same. 81/25 I think. My motor doesnt even get hot, and run time is good. STRIPPED A BELT so i know its got torque. I get the equizelant to a 13 turn motor. I barly pass him. How can you be touching 45 mph? i dont belive it at all. with 12 cells i might touch it. the tires baloon huge and it rides on the baloons. I dunno what to do. Someone give me words of knowlage :(

[yf22k]

In general, brushless motors don't have high rpm's...notice u said you stripped a belt. Brushless has loads of power If you gear ur brushless for more speed, u'll toast him easily.

[Prinler]

ok i put a healthy 30 on it lets say. I pass him but i get 3 min run times. Would excess wire be hurting me? i got like extra 5 inchs so it can reach. Maybeless

[yf22k]

hmm i don't feel like looking back in the pages but what setup do you have? and are your connectors getting hot? The runtime you're getting may be due to your batteries though. I get about 10 mintues of runtime in my Tb Evo II geared at 34/72 with a 3000mah NIMH. I'm using duratrax powerpoles and a basic 5300 schulze 18.61 setup

[Prinler]

4 post above this :p

Pro 3 with GP3300 matced packs and 2400 matched nicads. The expensive ones.
5300 with the Hacker Sport ESC. the conectors do not get hot. All running deans.

[yf22k]

Hmm it might be the nicads. I notice that i have less acceleration, rutime and speed with my nicads compared to my NIMH. I know very little about the hacker controller so i'm not sure what else could be wrong

[Prinler]

Exactly. No one seems to know why all my brushless goes so slow. Maybe i have higher standards. In the vidz i posted. the Nitros. Those are as fast as i want my Brushless to be. Its more afordable to go nitro.
People say Brushless is a nitro killer. Explain this to me. Nitro can run for hours. has more Acceleration and more top end. Ok a T-maxx on crack can do over 80mph. no brushless setup can make a maxx do over 80mph. Explain this. Any mod in either cadigory paired against the oposite in stock form can beat each other. Blushless only runs for 10 mins.

anyone wanna buy my maxx? :D

[ViciousKnives]

12 cells on a basic 5300?? isn't that a little excessive (for the motor that is)? i think lehner only recommends 6-8 cells for the basic 5300, which is why they're coming out with a new basic motor that's designed for 10-12 cell use.

[yf22k]

Originally posted by Prinler
Exactly. No one seems to know why all my brushless goes so slow. Maybe i have higher standards. In the vidz i posted. the Nitros. Those are as fast as i want my Brushless to be. Its more afordable to go nitro.
People say Brushless is a nitro killer. Explain this to me. Nitro can run for hours. has more Acceleration and more top end. Ok a T-maxx on crack can do over 80mph. no brushless setup can make a maxx do over 80mph. Explain this. Any mod in either cadigory paired against the oposite in stock form can beat each other. Blushless only runs for 10 mins.

anyone wanna buy my maxx? :D

My brushless isn't slow. I pretty much told you its your gearing. The runtime you're getting is probably due to your batteries.
We're trying to help you so try not to be so condescending.

[fReShJiVe]

Originally posted by yf22k
heh yeah sorry...i'm working a deal with someone right now

if they guy backs out and you willing to ship international ...do let me know

[yf22k]

yeah if this guy backs out i'll probably sell it to you. Its not that old i can't see how some poeple think i should sell my motor and controller so cheap. Then some people think its too cheap at $200

[GA Maxx]

i think around summer time ill be gettign a brushless motor. However for my rustler.

I will only run 6 cells, and i want a brushless set up that wil leasily beat a top 12 turn motor. is his possible wit ha brushless on 6 cells?

I also wanta speed controller that can handle?

so to summarise i want thefastest brushless motor and a Speed control that whne running 6 cells, will beat a 12 turn on 6 cells

is this possible?

will this fit the bill

Lehner Warrior 7018 with reverse - $131.95

Lehner #5300 Basic

with this on 6 cells wil li beat a 6 cell 12 turn motor?

im also gonna run 2400's how much run time will i get with the set up above


Cheers loads

[andy497]

Prinler:

You said 25 tooth runs too cool and 30 tooth runs too hot. If you do the math, that is a HUGE gear ratio change between those two.

When I'm changing setups, I never change by more than 1 tooth at a time. For example, I'm running a 16 tooth pinion on my setup, which is yielding about 9 min runtimes. I tried a 17 tooth, and this dropped to 6 minutes. 1 tooth change equaled 3 minutes!, so you can see how a big gear ratio jump can make a big difference. If you don't have a full pinion set, I'd get one. I got a 13 - 31 tooth set for something like $20.

Otherwise, I'd split the difference with a 27t and see how that goes.

[Mr. Constructor]

I wasn´t in there for a few days, but still read the posts, thanks to the guy who was defeating against this stupid Lord Radeon.
In the Case I haven´t slept, and was building on my new DSL Flatrate (that will be activated in 1 or 2 Months :( )
So here is the ultimate Killer of Nitro powered T Maxx:

A 2 BL 8th scale 2 wd truck, and the new thing:
There is still only ONE ESc on the system !!
There is alittle small trick to get 2 BL on one ESC (I will translate it carefully in English and then offered to everyone who asks me for it (will take maybe a week, because it could damage your motor if anything isn´t done right !!)

To Lord Radeon:

I think you´re the Stupid Crap, don´t get other people P*ssed, until you´re really shure what they´re talking about !!
The following Pic is a 2 BL and ONE Esc setup that worked very well !! (no cogging or anything else)
I really know what I´m talking, I will never harm People doing this great hobby.
If they ask me I will prompt them a right and a good answer or I will say that I don´t know it exactly !!

I´ve been into BL for nearly 5 - 6 Years now, maybe I know from what I´m talking about . . . .
Puh - I was a little angry about this . . . . .
Ok it´s over, THIS really functions but there is a little trick to get the system dialed in.
You have to be in the technology to get this, but it will function !!

Lean back and watch . . .
(little theatralic ok, just enjoy another piece of cake in this great hobby !!)

see ya all

To Reshijve (sorry I have to tip it in )
maybe you wanna buy a esc over me directly, send me a mail and we will see what is up . . .see ya !!

[Mr. Constructor]

Here is the second pic:

[Prinler]

Originally posted by yf22k
My brushless isn't slow. I pretty much told you its your gearing. The runtime you're getting is probably due to your batteries.
We're trying to help you so try not to be so condescending.

what are you talking about? I know why i get no run time when i gear to high. we went over this. Im just destraught about all the money i spent to just have a 13 turn mod. Sorry if i sounded like an ass but im totaly floored.

[RCmaniac324]

Originally posted by X-treme Pro 3
i think around summer time ill be gettign a brushless motor. However for my rustler.

I will only run 6 cells, and i want a brushless set up that wil leasily beat a top 12 turn motor. is his possible wit ha brushless on 6 cells?

I also wanta speed controller that can handle?

so to summarise i want thefastest brushless motor and a Speed control that whne running 6 cells, will beat a 12 turn on 6 cells

is this possible?

will this fit the bill

Lehner Warrior 7018 with reverse - $131.95

Lehner #5300 Basic

with this on 6 cells wil li beat a 6 cell 12 turn motor?

im also gonna run 2400's how much run time will i get with the set up above


Cheers loads

Yes, the Basic 5300/Warrior 7018 combo works quite well, and will especially be good since Lehner just upgraded the software of their controllers to eliminate coging and other minor problems. I should know...I own that setup.:D :p I have it in my MRC Ironman (think a beefier, taller-standing, cooler looking Evader-type truck, except made by a little known company), and I just so happened to run a 12T before I switched, and let me tell ya, this setup kicks! With Stock gearing (!!!) it ran about 40-45MPH, b/c the 12T ran about 30MPH and this seemed much faster. And that's on 6 cells. The motor just barely gets warm and the controller stays cool. And I still have room to gear up for more speed and add two more cells for even MORE speed.:D :p Trust me, this setup rocks, and I would reccomend it for you. Its cheap, easy to use, and has loads of power and speed for ya.:)

As for runtime, Rumrunner has tested 2400's with that setup in an RC10 (original one), and they got about 8 minutes, so in a rustler, I'd say about 10 minutes, then you can still get better batteries...:)

Now if only I could get myself out to buy a replacement idler gear for the one I shredded....:D :p Lol.

Hope this helps. L8r.:)

[yf22k]

Originally posted by Prinler
what are you talking about? I know why i get no run time when i gear to high. we went over this. Im just destraught about all the money i spent to just have a 13 turn mod. Sorry if i sounded like an ass but im totaly floored.

yeah well it was just a suggestion and you realized it was your gearing after i suggested ur batteries. andy497 posted that your gearing difference was a bit big after i suggested your batteries. You need to learn some patience.
After i suggested something you came right out and acted like i didn't know what i was talking about. I dont' know your exact situation and the condition of your equipment so i'm giving suggestions.

"we went over this"...well you had no idea what was going on when i gave my suggestion now did you? so how did we go over that already?

Reading back on all your other posts, it seems you used the same impatient and condescending diction. If you want help you might want to lighten up.

[tc3punk]

hello everyone:p

a buddy of mine just purchased 2 domain names:

www.brushless.net
and
www.brushless.org

the site isn't up yet, but hopefully soon, they'll be up
and they will also be the same site, just have 2 different URL's

also, my same friend got a "blair witch" type of movie of his pede

Eh, it was about 2am, decided to make a small vid. A basically stock Stampede running an al. idler, steel yolks, sealed tranny filled with grease, RPM bearing carriers, and the "shaft re-inforcement" mods. The brushless is a 1930/5 with a 18150 controller, running stock gearing. The battery is a BallisticBattery RC2400 8-cell side x side pack. You be the judge.

Brushless Pede Vid (http://www.brushless.net/old/blpedemisc.wmv)

gl all:p

[k_sw31]

Prinler- I really dont have a clue what is wrong with your setup, my setup roasts my old 13 turn speed gems, and a mean ROASTS. IN run time, speed, and torque. One thing that seemed to help when I was setting my controller up was to make sure the middle motor wire on the ESC was hooked up with the middle wire on the motor, then, I hooked the two out side wires up, and on way it just seemed to work much better that the other.... that is really all I can think of, unless there was a factory defect with the controller....


Another note- I upped a couple teeth on my pinion today, even faster than before but still just as smooth :D The only thing though, my T3 had an encounter with a brick piller, total yard sale, I basically need a new T3 front end :p Ah, the power of BL :D

[BJMFH]

That video was pretty cool. Burnouts rule! I want to see that thing making some speed runs or tearing up some dirt.

Prinler, brushless setups are all about experimentation. A few days ago I was pretty burnt out on the whole brushless scene too, that and the fact that I was sh*t-faced. But now that I have a setup that works, I'm happier than a pig in sh*t! You just have to find the right stuff for your vehicle.

In my ignorant opinion, gettting brushless to work for you is a matter of finding the right gearing, motor, speed controller, type of cells, and number of cells for your rc. That's 5 different factors right there. If any one of those is wrong, your whole setup is f*cked and it won't perform the way you want it to.

The emaxx motor you have seems to have a pretty low rpm per volt ratio. You have to run a buttload of cells for it to make some serious speed. Try a motor with a lower turn.

Make a trip up to your hobby shop and buy a whole bunch of pinion gears. I have pinion gears size 18-34 for my TC3. I just kept trying each one until I found the right gears for acceleration, top speed, or a combination of both. It's a pain in the ass to keep switching gears out, but well worth it.

As far as ESCs are concerned, the higher the amp rating, the faster it will be and less it will cogg. Decide how many cells you want to run and make your decision accordingly. Find one to suit your needs.

Batteries are really important. Buy some matched NIMH 3300s with a high voltage rating (1.14 or higher) and you should be good. Don't skimp on a charger either, buy a quality peak detection unit that has an adjustable charging rate. The charger must also be able to charge the number of cells you want to run.

You probably already know all this, so I'm sorry if I'm repeating stuff that you already know. So far I've owned 2 different brushless setups and spent over 700 dollars on both of them. I know how frustrating it can to spend alot of money and not see any results. But once you get it right, it will all become quite apparent why everyone loves their brushless setup. Nothing will ever replace the feeling you get when you make that first successful speed run and it suprises the h*ll out of you (except sex, but that's another story). Keep trying dude, there is a light at the end of the BL tunnel!

[Soya v1.1]

You swear too much.

[yf22k]

lol.

I'm looking to get another brushless setup to replace the one that i'm selling. I like the schulze 18.61 controller because it is fairly cheap and i like it. I am thinking of going away from the basic series motors. I'd like to hear some opinions on the 1515 series motor. I was looking at maybe a 1515/6 instead of another basic 5300. I plan on using it in either my TB Evolution II or my F201 with 3000mah NIMH and geared accordingly. I would like to hear some opions on this. thanks

[tc3punk]

on my site (click here to help support my spam habbit (http://www.tc3.1dumb.com) ) theres' vids of Ivan's cars

it's a 15 series (not sure if it's a 1515 or 1520) but it hauls on 7 cells

gl:cool:

[yf22k]

thanks tc3punk

[BJMFH]

Originally posted by Soya v1.1
You swear too much.


You ought to hear in me person dude!:D

I try to edit myself on a board where profanity is frowned upon. At least I have the decency to put little * marks in place of the vowels.

Besides, I was in Marine Corps infantry (0311) for 4 years. The language in the Marines isn't exactly church talk, you try enlisting and see how your vocabulary is effected.

[ViciousKnives]

how much is a pinion set??

oh yeah, and spur and pinion size (48 pitch) would you guys recommend for a tc3 with a basic 5300?

[k_sw31]

Well, a good starting point is to gear about where you'd gear a 15-17 turn, and then work your way up or down accordingly... :)

[BJMFH]

I've never seen a pinion set before. It sure would have saved me alot of money, I bought all mine individually.

I'm running a 5300 in my TC3 too. I haven't changed the 72 tooth spur gear. I use the following tooth pinion gears for various applications.

18-20 fast acceleration, low top speed

23-26 moderate acceleration, moderate top speed

30-34 slow acceleration, high top speed

How you should gear your motor all depends on where you plan on running it. If you plan to do alot of parking lot bashing, use a pinion gear with many teeth (30 and up) that can take advantage of the wide open space. If you like to race on smaller carpet tracks, use pinions gears with 20 teeth and below.

There is no single gear ratio that is "the one". I wish there was, it would make my life alot easier.

Disclaimer: None of my advice even comes close to being fact. I only "know" this stuff from personal experience. Which means that I could be completely wrong and talking out of my a*s. Ask Mr. Constructor or Andy497, they know their sh*t.

[BJMFH]

I got a question of my own now.

Do you guys recommend running your motor with or without the heatsink? I drive a FT TC3 and it included a blue heatsink in the kit. I usually don't run with it installed because the motor doesn't get that hot unless I'm running mutiple packs through it indoors.

Also, for all you 5300/TC3 owners, does your motor mount ever come loose after a hard run? I use the 3mm motor mounting screws that came with the kit, but the mount still comes loose every now and then. I tried to tighten them further but only managed to strip two of the four holes in my 5300. I can now see the copper wire through both holes that were stripped. I'm pretty sure that I broke through the little plastic shield. The motor still runs fine and nothing is binding, but I'm still concerned.

[ViciousKnives]

can't answer your question b, but, i have another question. has anyone put a brushless setup on a pancar?? i bet pancars must be crazy on a brushless setup.

[Mr. Constructor]

To BJMFH:

Maybe you should try a M3 feather ring!!
put the feather ring as anormal shim right between the AluMount and the head of the screw, but as the feather ring takes some feather weight (some forces) onto the screw, the screw cannot loosen that much.
maybe you should also use a VERY little drop of screw cement only right behind the head of the screw, in a way that only a few windings of the screw will be secured in the motor.
That is a worth thing on all BL, the mountingshield is only Aluminium not steel as in the 540er class, so you just have to be careful to mount them !!
(maybe you have to combine these 2 solutions to get a good result . . . .??)
Dont worry about the see through thing, the inner "plate" is only a piece of special teflon coated paper, so it is now bended backwarts, you only have to be careful that no dust comes into the BL through these holes, thats it, nothing could be damaged in the inside !!

To Prinler:

Have you fixed the problems with your setup??
If not, please post a complete listing of every main Item you use that will be very helpful to figure out where the sh*t is !!

See ya !!

[OptimaMan]

Regarding being able to see the wires through the screw holes: Be careful.... be very careful not to use screws that are too long. It seems you've already broken through the teflon seal. As long as you don't put screws that are long enough to actually damage the wires, you're okay. But, if you start hitting wires and screwing into them, you'll create short circuits and possibly damage your controller or give you bad/erratic motor performance. The Basic 5300 only gives you like 3 mm or so of thread. The Hacker B50 series motor gives you a full 6 mm of thread so it's a bit more difficult to strip.

I don't know who was asking, the Lehner 15 series motors are great, but their RPM/Volt isn't that high so you would need to gear it up real high or use a lot of cells.

For blistering speed, use a Hacker B50 with 6 turns. Now, that's a fast motor.

Question for anybody who knows... is it true that the C40 and B50 motors are the same size externally but the B50 is actually a larger motor inside?

[herbalist]

Greetings

I'm just going to try brushless motors on my TAMIYA TRF-414M

Currently there are only few brushless models available in my country and I beleive nobody here has tried them ever, so.....I'm here now and seeks for your advice.....

the available brands are

Motors--

Hacker C40-8S, 10S, 12S
Kontronic FUN-480-55

Kontronic BEAT-70-CAR
HACKER MASTER CAR COMPETITION/SPORT

I'm using the 6C setup

Please help me to decide

Thanks very much!!!!

[BJMFH]

Thanks for the advice Mr. Constructor and OptimaMan!

My screws are only 3mm and aren't touching the wires, but I'll be real careful anyway.

[OptimaMan]

I take it back.... I just came back from the race track today. I ran my XXX-S Graphite + with a Hacker B50 6 turn with various gearings and my Lehner Basic 5300. For some odd reason, no matter what gearing I used, the Lehner Basic 5300 blew the doors off the Hacker B50S 6 turn motor.

So, for touring sedan purposes, GET THE LEHNER 5300.

In addition, I was running indoor carpet (high traction) and I tried both motors with two different controllers. The Schulze 12.97 fwe versus the Hacker Master Car Sport model. The Schulze blows the doors off the Hacker. The Hacker (even though it was 200 bucks) still had some "cogging" problem... it was slight, but no good for racing touring cars. In addition, it got HOT... hot enough that it started to limit the current so I would run slower and slower. While, the Schulze 12.97 ran flawlessly at the same gearing.

So, for racing purposes, do yourself a favor and get a Schulze controller.

Regarding the guy who couldn't do wheelies on his emaxx.... probably because of the controller. I bet you could easily pull one with a Schulze.

SO, to make a long story short - if anybody out there really wants to start with brushless combo that's great for touring cars and racing, get the Lehner Basic 5300 (like 120 bucks) and get a Schulze 12.97 fwe with BEC (like 270 bucks). Sure, the initial investment is 400 bucks... but this is an awesome and great combo. BTW, the Schulze also has reverse - but the delay is rather long - like 4 seconds. There are cheaper Schulze models, but if you really want the benefits of HIGH POWER of a brushless system, don't get anything less than the 12.97 or 18.97 (my opinion). The 18.97 can handle 18 cells, but has no BEC.

One more thing... I'm putting my almost brand new Hacker controller up for sale on ebay... even that slight 1/4 second delay was annoying to me. I only used the controller for 1 pack today just for comparison.

[yf22k]

I ran my lehner 5300 schulze 18.61 setup in my tb evolution II last night. OMG was this thing fast. good thing i have a 3pjfs to set steering and throttle response curves. My radio made it easier to control at high speeds and accelerations. I actually flipped my evo II at high speed. I was turning and it suddenly got an amazing amount of grip and just rolled over 3 or 4 times.

I'm wondering if the lehner 1515/6 would be better for a touring car than a 5300. Does anyone have a good idea of how much if so? I would run it with the same schulze controller

[Soya v1.1]

Originally posted by ViciousKnives
can't answer your question b, but, i have another question. has anyone put a brushless setup on a pancar?? i bet pancars must be crazy on a brushless setup.

I put my Hacker and 12 cells in my Bolink Pro Stock. It went really fast until it hit something really solid:p

[ViciousKnives]

hahahaha, did the chassis break???

[Soya v1.1]

Yes, along with virtually everything else. That was nasty. Damn fencepost:p

[k_sw31]

Yeah, my T3 was going real fast a couple days ago until it hit something really solid, a brick pillar to be exact! :p Luckily I didn't break the chassis, that was already broken :p

[jkoppk]

Here's my TC3 on 14 team matched GP3300 cells from Pro Match.I'm using a Hacker B50 8S and a Schulze 12.97fwe controller.As soon as the weather clears i'm gonna clock it with my radar gun and see how fast it can go.I'm guessing 70+mph.I had to use a seperate reciever pack because of the # of cells.I'll post the results when I get a chance to run it.

[AEcrazyT3]

Originally posted by jkoppk
Here's my TC3 on 14 team matched GP3300 cells from Pro Match.I'm using a Hacker B50 8S and a Schulze 12.97fwe controller.As soon as the weather clears i'm gonna clock it with my radar gun and see how fast it can go.I'm guessing 70+mph.I had to use a seperate reciever pack because of the # of cells.I'll post the results when I get a chance to run it.

Great setup! How long is the run time on something like this.. I think I am going to buy a bl setup for my xxxs.....

[Soya v1.1]

I'm assuming you know that the cell limit on the 8S is 12.

[jkoppk]

Great setup! How long is the run time on something like this.. I think I am going to buy a bl setup for my xxxs

I'm not sure how long the 14 cells will last but when I run just 7 cells with a gear ratio of 29/60 it runs for about 6 minutes and topped out at 49mph then the batts dump.If I run 20/72 gearing I get about 12 minutes at a slower top speed.I think with 14 cells it might last 3 minutes or so.Just long enough for 2 or 3 speed passes will be enough for me.

[jkoppk]

I'm assuming you know that the cell limit on the 8S is 12.

Yes,but when I talked to Chris from fine designs I was told that all the motors that failed when using more than 12 cells did so when brakes were set to high.The sudden stop from such high speeds causes the insides to let go.I'm going to drift and set the brakes very low.If something goes wrong I will just buy a new motor.Chris did say this type of motor failure wasn't covered under his lifetime motor replacement policy.

[Soya v1.1]

What you say may be true, but isn't it kind of a silly to spend $180 more just because you used 2 extra cells?

[BJMFH]

Originally posted by OptimaMan

One more thing... I'm putting my almost brand new Hacker controller up for sale on ebay... even that slight 1/4 second delay was annoying to me. I only used the controller for 1 pack today just for comparison.

I agree, I used to own the Master Sport too. I now own the Hacker Competition and all the delays, cogging, and hesitations have been eliminated. I have tried to get that thing to cogg and can't. Full throttle starts with a 34 tooth pinion gear, uphill, wheels fully turned, and it still wouldn't cogg. The Sport is great for bashing though. It just isn't up to the task of racing.

That Schulze 12.97 sounds pretty bad*ss. My Hacker puts out 90 amps cont. and 120 peak. What are the ratings on yours like?

I tried racing my TC3 with a 5300/Hacker ESC combo today on a small carpet track. The course was setup for 1/12. The car just seemed too powerfull for the course. I was using an 18 tooth pinion gear too, but that didn't help that much. My suspension was a bit stiff, but I was running foam tires. I owned everyone on the straightway but they were killing me in the turns.

Everyone was laughing at me. People couldn't figure out what hell I was running. I was driving all slow through the turns but my car roared to life as soon as I hit the straightway. It even made a really cool howling noise. It sucks because there aren't any really big on road courses in my area so I'm stuck racing on this small track.

[OptimaMan]

Hey BJMFH, the specs on the Schulze 12.97 fwe is 97 amps continuous and 120 amps peak... similar to your competition model. I'm assuming though the reverse delay on the Hacker is much shorter than the 4 seconds that I'm forced with. They're both adjustable timing... mine doesn't have current limiting functions though - but I would never use it anyway.

I like the fact the Hacker is in a case, but that thing is frigging huge. The Schulze is just as long and wide, but 1/4 the height... but that heat shrink is resistant to any kind of servo tape.

At the track, I ran into the same problem - too much power for a small place. They say the track is large, but it seems pretty small. I never could reach top speed there. I was blowing past people on the straightaway but my car wasn't hooked up so they were lapping me through all the turns. By the way, when I say blowing past people, I was flying by them.... like when you go 100 mph past an old granny doing 55.

I'm going back to off-roading and wondering if I should get a buggy, truck, or Emaxx.

[Soya v1.1]

I had the wierdest dream last night. I dreampt I was looking around my uncle's attic, and found an ancient monster truck. It was solid axle, had a transmission in the rear, and a single motor. And the wierd thing is, it had a Hacker BL controller from like the 60's!

[Prinler]

Your a nut :p

[RadicalRustler]

opimaMan, gear lower, you'll get to top end on the straights and blow past em even faster. and longer practice times! (for an off roader, do a 1/8th scale 4wd buggy nitro to bl conversion)

[Vipaz]

Regarding the 14 cell car, the run time really depends on how you wire the packs. If they are wired in series, you get 16.8 volts (I can't imagine most ESC's would be to pleased with you for that) and a rediculously short run time. Conversely, if they are wired in parallel, you'll get 8.4 volts, but it'll run 'till the cows come home.


Cheers,
Al:cool:

[andy497]

about jkoppk's car:
Well, the primary limiting factor for brushless motors is current and not voltage. If they rate the motor at 12 cells they're probably not kidding though, so I might not risk it. On the other hand, controllers are voltage-limited. Running higher than listed (12.97 is max 12 cells) could risk burning the mosfets, which sets you back a few bucks quick. They probably give conservative estimates, so you might be ok if you keep everything cool. I sure wouldn't try it, but I don't have that kind of money to throw around.

to optima, I'd love to hear that my 5300 would beat a b50 6t, but by all accounts the hacker should smoke the lehner. maybe the track was tight enough that the weight made a difference? I also wonder if trying different timings/frequencies made a difference. In an airplane or some other setting where you can run full throttle all the time, that hacker should cranking it out. I think that's part of the problem though, full throttle ratings for motors and escs don't apply as well when you move to cars and spend most of your time at part throttle.

I found some interesting pages for brushless info (if you don't mind your head exploding). They are geared toward airplanes, but a lot of the info is applicable. (It would be great if all we had to do was pick a prop size to determine the load we were putting on the motor) From here, I found that the peak efficiency of the hacker b50 6 turn is reached at around 120 amps for 6 cells! That is insane.

http://www.aveox.com/torque.html
and
http://www.aveox.com/selection.html

I think there might be some more info on that site as well.

The down side to having nice formulas for calculating output is that most manufactures don't list specs for their motors. (Just Kv is not enough, you need R and Io as well)

[jkoppk]

about jkoppk's car:

Well, the primary limiting factor for brushless motors is current and not voltage. If they rate the motor at 12 cells they're probably not kidding though, so I might not risk it. On the other hand, controllers are voltage-limited. Running higher than listed (12.97 is max 12 cells) could risk burning the mosfets, which sets you back a few bucks quick. They probably give conservative estimates, so you might be ok if you keep everything cool. I sure wouldn't try it, but I don't have that kind of money to throw around.

The 12.97 is the exact same controller as the 18.97 and can also handle 18 cells.The reason they say a limit of 12 cells is the BEC can't be operated using that many cells.If you use a seperate reciever battery pack as I am that issue is gone.Chris from Fine Designs gave me the controller info also.If the motor does get damaged it gives me a real good excuse to put a B50 XL series motor in it.

[andy497]

Chris from Fine Designs gave me the controller info also.If the motor does get damaged it gives me a real good excuse to put a B50 XL series motor in it.

hehe, I can't argue with that. :)

Let us know what speeds you hit. Hey, also, where did you get a radar gun and how much do they cost?

[jkoppk]

I got the radar gun online at Opticsplanet.com it's a Bushnell Speedster and cost me $199.I got the Quicksilver gun first for $89 and it didn't work well so I got the Bushnell.I'm in Pa. and I just hope we have a nice weather soon so I can make some runs.The last 3 were rain and snow.

[BLK]

Well, I hope I can get a little help here. I am working on my tc3/5300/18.61 combo again. I haven't had a chance to in some time, so I thought I'd give it a go tonight. Thus far I have been unable to get the esc to set up correctly; i.e. it wont read the full throttle and stop points correctly. I get the start tones when I plug in the bat pack. Then no tones unless and until I pull the throttle. When I give it full gas, I get the double tone (as per the instructions), but when I take the throttle back to neutral, no tones. I push it into the brake/reverse position, then I get the single tone (indicating the stop point). At this point, the motor goes into forward, and the motor won't stop unless I push the throttle all the way forward. I'm sure its something simple, but I cant figure it out, and its driving me nuts. Any help would be appreciated!!!

I have set it up according to the directions, but the motor runs unless I push the throttle into the full brake/reverse position. I have been able to adjust the controller (via throttle trim) and I have been able to get the motor to stop, but there is now, no coasting. It either goes forward or hits the brakes.


Also, I'm not sure if this is important or not, but I am not running an on/off switch for the receiver. Once I plug in the RX pack and the bat pack, the car is ready to go.

sorry if my description is confusing, but not sure how else to explain it. help me....please help me....

BK