Mugen 1/8th scale electric buggy is here!

[Craps]

It is the Mugen MBXR 4 that Chris Fine owned at Fine Design Marine, who also makes conversion kits for Mugens only. He sent a huge Hacker B50 10XL brushless motor. This motor is huge. The TP8000-2S4P Li-Pos strap in on each side after I made a "Y" harness to hook up to a Hacker Master Comp ESC that I had a problem getting it to work until a phone call to Hacker, who said to unhook the BEC wire and hook up a reciever battery pack.

"Houston.... we have a go for launch!!!!!"

Front yard and down the street with the true test results is when the wife comes out and comments on how fast that thing is, that is when you know it is fast.

That thing is a rocket and I can't wait to get it to the track tomorrow.

I can't imagine this thing with a pair of TP8000-3S4P 11.1 volt Li-Pos.

It has so much torque, it partially stripped the pinion gear, which was hardened steel and the pitch (?) is big on these gears.

To the track to get some run times if my pinion gear last long enough.

[mac0326]

What controller are you running with that buggy? It used to run at my local track(I am VERY familiar with that buggy). The pinion/spurs are mod1 pitch I beleive. The pinions will wear out fairly quickly, but that is a quick buggy. I know they used to struggle with thermals on it(12.97 controller) and eventually stopped running it.

[Craps]

Hacker Master Comp

Chris said they would not let him run it there anymore due to being way faster than the gas buggies.

I believe it and you were right about eating the gear up.

[OptimaMan]

Metal spur gear? My emaxx's metal spur gear used to eat up pinion gears every 5th or so battery run so I went back to plastic spur gear.

Hey, no fair. I wanted to get a 1/8 scale BL buggy!!!!!

BTW, a 10XL is 1578 rpm/volt... You can stick up to like 44 volts with this monster!!! Heck, you put 44 volts on it, but 1/2 the capacity and drop a couple a gears and you'll REALLY have a monster! BTW, ThunderPower is releasing some new cells that have 1/2 the internal resistance!!!! So, you can be using 4000 mah packs to replace and be WAY lighter than 6 3300's.

[Craps]

Optimaman
This thing is eating up a hardened steel pinion gear. Now that is some torque and I noticed the back of the can with bearing in it moves around which is contributing to the pinion gear wear.

This thing has a huge amount of torque and power on 14.8 volts. I would hate to see this thing with 22.2 volts.

That motor mount setup Chris Fine is a neat set up and even anadiozed it to match. He conversions are only made to convert the Mugen MBXR-4 only.

I have got to find a pinion gear source for the big shaft on the B50 and the same pitch as the spur gear that is made out of the hardess metal I can find along with finding away to keep the back of the motor can from moving.

Track testing today to find out if the ESC will thermal and how long a run I can make on the pair of TP8000-2S4P batteries.

Plus I was told that Li-Pos will not work in an 1/8th due to amp draw was to great. I am going to find out.

[Twiggy_RC]

Hey Tim, you should get in touch with Jamie (305997) because he has a source for Mod 1 pinions. He's also been looking into Mod .8 pinions for use with 32 pitch spurs. You can e-mail him at starluckrc@charter.net

[Wizardman_1]

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0091p?&C=CLC&V=RRP

Are you using some of these or something else?

[DualBL]

*cough* (http://www.darkside-racing.com)

the prototype bottom main chassis has been cut, and will be shipped to me to finalize the top braces and any other modifications.
no promises on when they'll be ready for sale, but hopefully sooner rather than later.
After the H7 version is done, we may work on a different buggy, but only time will tell.
also, I think we may have a solution to ALL your gear problems... we'll see, and i'll post when the time is right.
-Nick

[Craps]

Today was almost a waste involving the Buggy with the gear stripped all the way. The motor is so long and heavy it is flexing to much along with the B50 motor shaft did not have a flat spot on it to lock the gear down, which also compounded the problem of eating up the gear.

I also noticed the damage was done and the greatest amount of flexing came with the braking. The Hacker Master Comp is not as smooth as a Schulze ESC. It is either full throttle/brake or totally off like a light switch.

It has huge amounts of torque and a gas buggy is not going to hang with it the first 10 feet.

Did not get any run times at all since I had to work with the gear from the time I hit the track.

Chris Fine gave me the number for Berg Gear to order some more steel pinion gears. I quess the racing debut will have to wait till the bugs are worked out.

I took out the XXX-4 with my Schulze 18.61K ESC and Lehner 5300 and blasted around the track. I think it is faster with Schulze/Lehner set up than it was with the Hacker ESC and C40 8 turn motor. The ESC is alot smoother and controllable.

[Craps]

Twiggy_rc
Thanks for reminding me. I talked to him by telephone and he has the gears and also a motor brace to take care of problems. I tried to get him to come up and race in Rock Hill, SC today (Sat) and to Cherryville, NC (Sun). You and Jamie come on up and run with us if you want too.

I ran my T-4 with the gas trucks last weekend at Easley and as usual my driving and steering geometry problem with some new alloy parts from GPM cost me getting into the "A" main. I was running away with the "B" main when the steering locked up. Had the same problem in both of my heats, but I have got it repaired now after testing yesterday at Cherryville.

[Craps]

Twiggy_rc
Andy, Thanks for the help today at the track. After you left I got my lap times down into the 20s and made an 80+ lap run. Practice, practice, practice!!!!

Jamie called and he is bringing the gears to me at Cherryville tomorrow for the Mugen.

[Simen123]

DualBL:
Do you have an idea on what the price will be?

[Simen123]

on the conversion for the Hyper7 that is :)

[alpinesky1]

Craps lets see some pics;)

[DualBL]

no clue, as the braces havn't been finished being designed.
I'm hoping that the final product will be under $150 including the gear adapters, the braces, the motor/diff mount, and chassis.
i'll update the site, once we get closer to final production.
-Nick

[Craps]

Originally posted by DualBL
no clue, as the braces havn't been finished being designed.
I'm hoping that the final product will be under $150 including the gear adapters, the braces, the motor/diff mount, and chassis.
i'll update the site, once we get closer to final production.
-Nick

I had help from an electrical engineer (Jamie) today that set my gears up and tested it for me since I was busy racing my T-4. We found out that between the Hacker Master Comp ESC lack of smoothness with braking and throttle control and the B50 10XL motor being very heavy on the motor mount flexing makes the pinion gear move around too much causing it to wear.

Motor heat is going to be problem when we start testing for long runs, but the speed and torque are more than equal to very modified gas buggy.

We really think the system needs higher voltage batteries to give extra power and hope that will cool off the motor a little. I may have to add heat sinks and a fan.

[bigair78]

do you have pics of your buggy. what is the cost of the conversion. Is there a link to it on a finedesigns website?

[Craps]

Hingepin took some pics and posted them on another thread here in the "Brushless" forum under "1/8th scale electric racing!" page 1 post # 23 has the pic of it. I have since reengineered it a little making where both batteries lay flat and I have parked it until I get the new 11.1 volt Li-Po batteries in.

Hacker B50 10XL motor $229 www.finedesignrc.com
Schulze 18.97KWF ESC $352 www.finedesignrc.com
UBEC for reciever $40 www.koolflightsystems.com

You still need to get somebody with a bridgeport to make you a motor mount out of a block of aluminum that mounts to the center diff tower.

You can buy 5mm bore 16 tooth mod1 pitch stainless steel pinion gears from SDI for $12 a piece. www.sdp-si.com

Batteries will be up to you!
I was using 2 TP8000-2S4Ps 7.4 volt each for a total of 14.8 volts. $318
I am waiting on 2 TP7600-3S4Ps 11.1 volt each for a total of 22.2 volts. $438
www.tppacks.com

You can do the math when you find a used or new buggy to convert.

[bigair78]

You said you bought the conversion off chris at finedesign. How much was that? Or did you make one?

[Craps]

I bought his shop one that he converted, but I wish I had done it myself due the fact all the conversion parts he made I have replaced with stronger and better pieces. You can take most any 1/8th scale buggy since about all of them copied each other with the design and parts. Make sure the center diff towers are aluminum and not plastic to mount the motor mount to where the brakes mounted up for the gas. You are going to remove the brakes and use the motor for braking.

Just find a roller chassis and start fabricating. If you are really patient, you could make everything with a good dremel tool and some aluminum. It would help to have the motor mount made with a bridgeport, but a dremmel is not out of the question.

Good Luck!

You can find roller chassis on E-Bay sometimes for around $200.

[DualBL]

I don't have pics of the conversion that we'll be selling, just some CAD's that i drew up.
my first design:
http://s92675604.onlinehome.us/darkside/images/proto/h7-blinged out.jpg

when me and Craps talked, I realized that that way, the motor's would have to be way up in the air. = no good
these in NO way represent what the finish product will be, but just of the basic layout.
http://s92675604.onlinehome.us/darkside/images/proto/h7chassis-bigmotor1.jpg
http://s92675604.onlinehome.us/darkside/images/proto/h7chassis-bigmotor4.jpg

and I decieded to see what battery mount/heatsink design i could come up with.
http://s92675604.onlinehome.us/darkside/images/proto/sidebrace.jpg

more info comming in the future.
-Nick

[Craps]

DualBL
When you going to quit drawing pictures and build that thing? Get the dremmel out and go to work! :D

Keep in mind motor, ESC and Battery heat. I ventilated the body on buggy with alot air holes.

I have the motor in the same place as the oringinal pictures, but I have reworked the servo location a little, cut out the gas throttle servo location and removed the reciever box so both batteries will lay down. Velcro and more velcro on everything along with some bolted down velcro straps across the sides of the batteries instead of end to end like Chris Fine had mine. It can break the wires on the Li-Pos strapping end to end.

Good Luck!
Tim

[DualBL]

lol, idk what's up.. my business partner has had mail trouble with the proto type chassis getting to me...
and forget dremel. these kits are gonna be CNC'd in the same factory as www.exoto.com models are made in. talk about quality!
and for the motor heat, that top deck, in the final design will most likely extend back to the rear diff and mount to it. this will make mounting all the electronics easier, and I'm also planning on making say 2 80mm fan cutouts, so you can mount fans directly above the motor(s)
any thing else?
-Nick

[racinlosi]

Of cource...you do this AFTER I start my project. :rolleyes: It seems great, I'm still wondering if my project should have a lexan chassis or a carbon fiber chassis? Also...keep in mind you want it to keep all the stuff(batteries, and motor) all evenly weighted on the chassis. Also, I signed up on oyur forums...do good not to. :D



Also...Craps, why do oyu always use Li-Pos? And how good do you think the new 3600 cells would do on a C50 motor that fits the E-Maxx? And what reciever do you think will do the best with that motor without going too high in price?