super G or manta ray need opinions

[scottericsonon]

just like the title says

been a lurker for quite awhile and finally decided to take the plunge

super G or manta ray are the ones im looking at but im open to opinions in the same price range (1000dollarish)

TIA scott

[Doubledog]

You guys knew I'd jump all onto this one! :p

Welcome. Its good to see some fresh names.

For a grand, go with the Manta!

Manta!

Manta!

:D ~ :D ~ :D

Serriously, you've got a lot of working room with that kind of money and should be able to get most any hull. You say you've been a lurker for sometime so you've read the love affair I've got with my two Super G's. (Kinky way to describe a boat huh?) :p Two reasons for the purchase of the first one- I read the review in Radio Control Boat Modeler & Price. My budget was limited but I wanted a new boat.

The Manta is indeed a gorgeous boat and fast from what folks have reported.

I'll ask you like I do everyone else... Ever consider buying used? I've seen where you've been on other sites and looking around. I'd personally like to try a(n) AC Lazer 45 w/stock 260. That boat looks good & is one of the faster ones out there.

But if you want to go new, Butch T' over at Jims is a distributor for WHH. I believe he'll beat most prices from WHH and has taken good care of me.

Seems like you're doing the right thing. Take your time and don't rush.

Best Regards,
Jamie

[Hydro Junkie]

Calm down DD! I know WHH is your first love :D but really...... I do agree though, I've heard nothing bad about either boat. DD is also right about checking around for something used. A word of caution though, if the person doesn't want to show you the boat without cash up front, don't take it!!! If the boat is worth anything, the seller should be more than willing to show pictures, at least. If you want new, what I would recommend is getting RTR. Not to offend DD, but with the RTR, you fuel it, start it and run it. I would also recommend getting trim tabs installed by the factory. I'm sure DD will tell you how helpfull they can be, depending on conditions. My only question is do you have a lot of room to run on, and is it fresh or salt water?

[Doubledog]

None taken my friend. :)

Very good points !

[scottericsonon]

i gots NO problem at all with a used boat

i just couldnt find one used that screams BUY ME!!!!!!!

id really prefer to stay away from RTR boats not just because theyre RTR but i like building stuff (dump trucks for a living)

im a very HANDS ON kind of guy and really enjoy the satisfaction of putting something together and learning how things work

RTRs have their place in life but not with me(unless i find a SCREAMING deal)

room to run is N/P HUGE lake 15 minutes from the house where i fish all fresh water

i was looking at the lazers too but just couldnt find enuff info on them

what i DONT want to do is buy a boat that turns out to be junk ( not saying it is) because i didnt do enough research

id REALLY like to buy a COMPLETE package (less electrics)all at once so im assured of having all the parts i need to complete the project

if i decide on either of these boats ill have to keep Butch Ts name in mind
good looking out DD

thanx scott

[Hydro Junkie]

From what I have read, most "new boaters" don't want to build. I guess it comes back to "instant gratification". I see this syndrome all the time in my "other hobbies". Nice to see someone else that doesn't mind getting their hands dirty :). If you like the Manta and Super G, you can order a bare hull and go from there. I'll bet DD's friend could get you everything in a package deal. I take it you have some knowledge of or have radio gear, as you said you didn't want electrics in the pack. My advise on radio gear is get the highest torque servo you can find for your rudder. Beyond that, I would only recommend a 75mhz FM radio with nicads. The only reason for FM is they are harder to get hit by outside signals and noise. I would stay away from the 27mhz AM systems, as Radio Shack, Tyco, and all the other TOY manufacturers tend to go with them, but you probably know that already. If you have any questions, I'm sure that between DD, Ron, myself and some others on this site, we can get you going :) Good Luck with your project, whichever way you decide to go :D

[scottericsonon]

ummmmmmm

lets see do i know anything about radios?

hpi savage
NTC3 built from a kit with a novarossi .12
scratchbuilt drag car with a rb concepts 21 and a 2 speed

countless hobby grade electrics that belong to my kids

ya i know just a little about radio control stuff (wink)

anyhow i have a KO EX-11 that im planning on using for the boat

i just bought a futaba pk3 for the NTC3 so i plan on using the radio that WAS on that

the only electronics id need that i dont already have is a 1/4 scale servo for the rudder

i know WHH will sell some of their higher grade boats in a kit so i may need to talk to DDs buddy

i didnt really want to go with the "buy the hull here ,hardware there ,engine over yonder" thing i just dont know enuff about boats to make sure im getting all the right stuff

thanx for ur help

scott
thanx scott

[Hydro Junkie]

You're a lot luckier than I am. I'm in the process of building three 1/8 and two 1/6th scale hydros. In my case, however, most of my parts have to be custom made, such as cowlings, engine mounts, struts, and just about everything else. I've only got one thing going for me, a machinist who makes parts lives half an hour away :) To make things nicer, he doesn't charge $50+ an hour to make parts, as he is a racer too :D I wouldn't worry about not knowing a lot about boats. With your R/C background, you shouldn't have much trouble figuring things out. One thought on servos, many of the radio manufacturers now have high torque servos with more power than the quarter scale types. I'm looking at a Futaba 9350 digital servo for my rudder servo. Futaba claims it's water and dust proof with 111oz/in at 4.8-139oz/in at 6.0. I had planned on using a quarter scale servo, but it only has 89oz/in at 4.8, so needless to say, I changed my mind. Don't know if your radio and Futaba digitals are compatible, but I thought I'd mention it anyway :)

[scottericsonon]

well this is going to be my very first boat

ive been messing with cars for quite awhile and theres been one or 2 expensive and disasterous forays into the airplane field

haveing 3 boys makes "TOYS" a bit easier to get past the wife
lol

i was looking at the hydros and they look a bit advanced for me

from all ive heard a V or a cat is the way to go for a starter boat

ill have to look into that futaba servo
thanx for the tip

scott

[BonziBandit]

Have you considered maybe a boat from Bonzi Sports? I too am new to gas boats and just purchased a 50" Bonzi with a G260PUM engine. I was very impressed with the build of the boat and the performance is outstanding. The owner Dan was a great help with the build of my boat and answered all my questions. I've been running Nitro truck for about 5 years and have over a dozen of them and this boat is so much easier to run than any truck I've ever had.

[FlyerCAN]

I have the WHH 57 Magnum and I do love the thing, but as it was being prepaired I wished I'd have chosen the Manta for its sleeker lid which makes it look so much smoother. To bad it doesn't fit on my boat or I would have one to replace mine.
Is there someone that does custom lids for any boat out there DD?

[Chris LaPanse]

Look at these:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXN609&P=0
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXWB65&P=0
Those are what I would chose for large scale boating :D . Cheaper than the more expensive standard servos too :p . FlyerCAN, I agree with you. I would get the Magnum if it wasn't quite so ugly (in my opinion). I love the Manta Ray, but the water I have is a little rough for it. So, now i'm stuck on which one to get. Oh, well. Scottericsonon, If you have smooth water go for the manta, or, if you want more speed, the super sport or team pro. If the water is really smooth, you might even want a Stingray. If the conditions are rougher, though, you want a Magnum 57 (unless you think it is as ugly as I do) Whatever you chose, I'm sure you will have a blast :D

[Shannon SC]

I guess that I am partial to the Manta Ray, but hey, it was my first gas boat. All of WHH boats that are kit form, come virtual complete, less electronics. The Manta Ray handles some pretty rough water, or at least mine does. It is not a race boat, but rather it is an excellent starter "SPORT" boat. Mine has provided an excellent learning experience and provided the knowledge necessary to understand performance model boating. After more than a year and about 300 miles I finally cracked the hull, I have been to the edge. Lane 1 around bouy 4-5-6 at 45+ MPH in rough conditions is the edge for the Manta Ray.

[NitroRipper]

Hello

Go over to Jims and look up a guy by the name of ACLazer, he has tons of knowledge on the Lazer hull and does sell them, he could hook you up with everything you need and when your building it he would be the man if you have any setup questions.

http://p086.ezboard.com/fjimsrcboatdockfrm2.showMessage?topicID=3104.topic


Ripper

[scottericsonon]

yes i was looking at the bonzis theyre pretty nice boats

ive been looking some more and am down to the manta or a cat from aeromarine or ac lazer

what r the advantages/disadvantages of a cat hull VS a deep V style like the manta??

TIA scott

[Hydro Junkie]

The advantage of a cat over a deep vee is that the hulls have a wing between them that lifts the hull higher in the water, like a modern hydroplane, but not quite so extreme. This wing makes the boat ride over swells better than a deep vee. It also makes the hull wider, making it more stable. The disadvantages are you have to run a longer flexshaft if you are running a single engine in the center. The CG is also higher in a tunnel, due to the tunnel requiring lifting the engine. Also, the wing is a double edged sword. Like with the hydroplanes, a tunnel CAN BLOW OVER, if the bow gets too high, much easier than a mono. Others can probably give you more pros and cons, too

[scottericsonon]

ok that may be a little too technical for me (im a dumba$$)

wich one would be the wise choice for a large lake a calm to med surface?

it boils down to a comprimise right?
the cat will go faster in a straight line and the V will corner better right? like an old Camaro VS a new Camaro
or am i way off base here? im just guessing
still learning here but your help IS appreciated

thanx scott

[Hydro Junkie]

Unfortunately, most of my experience is with hydros and monos, so I can't really answer that :( Both would be good in smooth to medium surfaces. I think, if that's normal for the lake, it comes down more to what style you like better. Sorry I can't help you more on that question. Oh, and by the way, you're not a dumba$$. Of all the new boaters I have dealt with, you have the most general knowledge I've seen. You also have the sense to know to ask questions BEFORE you buy, instead of after, when you got something you didn't really want :) Better still, you are asking LOGICAL questions, which makes it easier to try to help you out. What was too technical? Maybe I can put it in more laymanlike terms for you?

[scottericsonon]

actually after re-reading what you had said it makes more sense except for the flexshaft part
i mean i understand what a flexshaft is and what it does but what are the disadvantages of a longer one? does it flex TOO much?

im going to be running a single engine PROBABLY a zenoah 26

i like nitro in my cars but the boat is going to be a "TOY" therefore i want to gas and go without haveing to temp and tune all the time like my Novarossi

normal to the lake i plan on running is calm to med (2" or so)

have you ever dealt with rocket city racing? i was looking at the AC cat they have listed on their site and im REALLY liking that one

once upon a time i would have just spent money but im older and wiser now and have learned to look before i leap lol

at first when i started looking at boats (my LHS got in a 1/8 Miss Bid and a shockwave) i was all geared up to buy the Miss Bud but now im sure glad i didnt

ive bought too many Duds (not just RC stuff) NOT to have learned my lesson but hey we were all young and senseless once upon a time

LOL

again your help is greatly appreciated too bad youre on the other side of the country or id be happy to buy you a round

scott

[Hydro Junkie]

I see you've been reading all the stuff on the Pro Boat Buds(or should I say Duds :) ). The deal with the flex shaft being longer is that it needs to be lubricated and, to some extent braced, to prevent whipping. I bet Double Dog could tell you more on that. Otherwise, there isn't really much difference. In many of the deep vees, the shaft comes out the bottom with a slow bend to the strut. Others come out through the transom, at the bottom of the vee, with no bend before the strut. On a tunnel, the bend is much more extreme, but not having dealt with one, I don't know how much more extreme. The through the transom shafts are not easily adjustable, due to the short distance to the strut. That about covers flex shafts, at least for me. I just had a thought. If you like the looks of a hydro, for your second boat, what about the WHH Stingray? Another option is get a set of plans and build a hydro. I have one I'm building now in 1/6th scale. Just another option.

[scottericsonon]

"for your second boat" oh man is my wife gonna be pissed LOL

no no no 2nd HAS to be an electric for the kids to putz around with

plans and build my own would be a viable option for a future boat

i built my drag car from scratch running 1.7 second in a scale 1/4 (132 feet)

all C.F and aluminum chassis mostly associated steering stuff RB Concepts .21 NTC3 2 speed

its a real handful to run

im still looking around at boats tho so i dont have a problem with more opinions

TIA scott

[dag]

just an opinoin on your question of which hull to get (cat or V), I have a V and love it. I just prefer V's due to the realism compared to most full scale boats out there. Wind is not a factor for me. However, my next will probably be a cat. Cat's are very realistic compared to the real offshore racers. They seem faster due to riding higher in the water but the down side is everyone I see run a cat, it almost always blows over. If you go too fast into the wind they'll lift right up and flip. I would think for a starter the V is they way to go but it's your own personal liking. By the way I have a used WHH Man O War. I love it. Great boat and great company. My next choice maybe an Aeromarine cat or I'm curious to see the WHH cat.

[Shannon SC]

The best advice that I can give anyone interested in getting into the model boat hobby is, " Go to a district race". You'll find the experience very rewarding, you get to see all of the different types of boats actually perform and the guys running them are more than willing to talk with you, they all have their opinions, but you are old enough and wise enough to sort out the BS.

[scottericsonon]

a used Man O war huh???

interested in selling it to further your advances towards you cat???

thats a good looking hull

if i can come across one of those used id buy it

like i said i dont have a problem with used but it seems like everything i find its a COMPLETE RTR boat and guys want what i could build my own (or more)for them

scott

[Hydro Junkie]

Why would she get mad? I'm just throwing out options for down the road. As a R/C modeller, you know as well as I there is always "the next one". The only questions are "What do I build?" and "When do I have the time, money, and the boss' approval?" We all know SHE is the boss, right? If not, SHE will let you know otherwise :D How old are the kids? One thought is to get a set of plans for a older picklefork hydroplane and let each build their own boat. Of course, you have the call on who uses the tools. If you scale it down to 1/10th scale and put in electric drive systems, then they could each have their own boat to race with :) If built with 1/16 thick ply, they would be lite enough to be quick, but heavy enough to not be REAL fast :cool: At the same time they build electric boats, you build your gas one(I know, I don't have kids to deal with). Now everyone is happy(except the wife), what could be better? Quality time with the kids, everyone is out of the wife's hair for a while. Just don't forget the dozen roses every week and you're good to go :D

[scottericsonon]

ya i hear you on "the next one"

kids are 17 14 12 (boys) and 7 (girl) ALL into RC

its like a hobby shop over here friggin cars and trucks and HotWheels EVERYWHERE

1/32 scale slot car track in the basement

it think we are up to a total of 17 R/C vehicles

like 25 different slot cars

scott

[Hydro Junkie]

Gee, does that mean instead of electric, you go with .21's for the boys?
I hope your wife didn't see this :)

[dag]

no chance in me selling it! sorry like too much plus I got a great deal. If you think guys are selling 'em for what you could build em' for, be patient on ebay maybe. Or jims/rcboatdock. I can't seem to get a password over there for some reason. Anyway, not to take away from Tony and WHH's but DD suggested I look on ebay (which I had) and low and behold after 2 weeks I was decideing between boats! I went w/ the Man O War, pristine condition, top of the-line hardware, homelite 30cc pro-mod and the exact color I wanted for $800. I felt that was a great deal. It's risky buying off ebay but could be worth it. I feel the biggest -/ to my boat is it has one of those reliable homelites that is slower than a ZEN, but a guy w/ the same boat w/ a ZEN 260 said mine is faster and I have to agree! Maybe he hasn't tapped into his real potential but I'm still experimenting w/ props too.

But hey, bottom line I'm finding out is, no matter what you save/spend your always going keep spending more and more looking to improve and upgrade!!!

[Hydro Junkie]

Can you say SCORE!!!!!!! I never get that lucky. Guess that's why I build 'em myself.

[Doubledog]

In the same situation now.

I'm wanting a blank hull (new hull, no holes drilled) and install my hardware. Why? To me half the fun is building. These boats are not difficult to understand... thats why we have each other here :).

Problem........ Practice what you preach. The best deals out there by far is to buy used. Let someone else take the hit (loss) and pass the savings on to you. Man, you can buy RTR stuff 1/3 to 1/2 less than what the same thing would be new.

As I've told others and am now telling myself...... "patience young grasshoppa".

Its so hard when you have a NIB 260pum and all the running gear waiting for you on the shelf. LOL.

[scottericsonon]

just wanted to let everyone know im buying a NEW AC Boats blast cat

scott

[FlyerCAN]

What is the web page for those AC boats? Can't seem to find it.

[scottericsonon]

What is the web page for those AC boats? Can't seem to find it.


ya its a bit confusing canada and all i think

http://www3.telus.net/acboats/

the blast cat isnt on their site yet tho

try this guy http://www.rocketcityracing.com/tek9.asp

the one im probably getting is right on the front page

i emailed rocketcity and they said they will have hulls middle of next week

im probably going to buy off of them

seems like a pretty reliable shop

i know theyre fast with their emails and all and ive gotten some pretty good feedback about them

they have a hard ware kit for the blast HK-BC40G $200

and the lazer 45 HK-LAZ45G $250

im tossed up between their stuff (speedmaster) and ballentines hardware
http://www.ballantinehobbies.com/

they have got some SWEET stuff but you pay for it

i should know more buy the middle of next week


scott

[FlyerCAN]

http://www3.telus.net/acboats/new.html
saw this link on the AC site for the blast cat