Tower has GTB in stock

[DaveG35]

Tower Hobby has the GTB in stock - limited quantities. Just order mine.

[ElectricThunder]

I saw that. I think I'm gonna wait till they have non-limited quantities and to see if there's any bugs with this new system. (plus I just paid car insurance...so now I gotta start savin' again...:()

[AudiTT-Quattro]

Interesting... The local distributors here don't even have them yet. Novak jumped the gun on Tower I guess.

Oh well, I would still rather wait until they get all the bugs worked out of the first batch.

[schenck77]

good news, time to check and see if they filled my order.

[Simen123]

My GTB 5.5 is now being "Picked and Packed" in Tower`s warehouse, according to my account. This will be fun :D

[DaveG35]

It looks like Novak beat Castle Creations (Mamba Maxx) to the market.

[tcolesen]

It looks like Novak beat Castle Creations (Mamba Maxx) to the market.

That surprised me. Wasn't the Mamba Maxx being advertised quite a while before the Novak GTB was? The Mamba Maxx isn't even in the beta testing stage yet, it's at least 2 months off.

[Tyrael1986]

what exactly is the GTB used for? large scale trucks or ST's and buggies? i was thinking of getting one for a T4..

[Rtsbasic]

One would in theory work very well in a T4. Useless for large trucks like Emaxx etc but very good for 1:10 ST's/buggies.

[Tyrael1986]

so they would have a lot of torque and speed? what is the turn equivalent from the gtb to a normal brushed motor? the gtb is like 5 turns i think so what would that be compared to a brushed motor?

[Rtsbasic]

5.5 turns for the fastest, which is supposed to be around a 9 turn brushed performance I think? The LRP feels very similar to drive to a 9x2 motor, and the Novak is going to be about the same, maybe a tad faster.

[Simen123]

If I`m not mistaken, the LRP/Reedy motor is a 7.5T..... :)

[Rtsbasic]

Can't be, the SS5800 is only 8.5t? And that isn't close to a 9, 10 or 11 turns performance. You have to overgear it really to match a 12 turns power.

[Tyrael1986]

so a GTB system would be a prime investment for a T4 then? i would probably get it to swap between my 3 trucks. but if it works, it works right? thanks for the info I'm gonna read up on these a bit more.

[ElectricThunder]

Can't be, the SS5800 is only 8.5t? And that isn't close to a 9, 10 or 11 turns performance. You have to overgear it really to match a 12 turns power.
I think the 5800 is over rated performance wise. Couple that with the fact that the reedy probably has a stronger magnet than the novak (and is run on a better ESC) then I could see the neo being equivalent to maybe a 10 or 11 turn? But 9?! :eek:

[Simen123]

BTW, my GTB 5.5 shipped from Tower yesterday :)

The SS system was pretty overrated performance wise, at least when driving on-road(high grip)..
Two friends of mine has the new LRP system in their 2wd off-road cars, and it easily matches a 10T there. Lots of rpm!
Don`t know how it performs in a touring car though :)

[Kyosho Fan]

What a joke, the "5.5 GTB" is back to "on order" and my old backorder has not even shipped during "limited stocks". Looks like Towers is trying hard to confuse customers.....

[Rtsbasic]

I've driven the new LRP a bit at the local track (it was fitted an Xray touring car), it really does feel like about a 9 wind, the way the guy had his car geared anyway. Very revvy. Faster than both my Mtroniks motors, although not as torquey.

[ElectricThunder]

I've driven the new LRP a bit at the local track (it was fitted an Xray touring car), it really does feel like about a 9 wind, the way the guy had his car geared anyway. Very revvy. Faster than both my Mtroniks motors, although not as torquey.
Sounds promising....:D

[elcid4300]

I just read somewere that there were mistakes made with backorders. It had something to do with a warehouse mixup. If you have one on backorder, I would HIGHLY recommend you call them to find out the deal.

[BLRustler]

I just read somewere that there were mistakes made with backorders. It had something to do with a warehouse mixup. If you have one on backorder, I would HIGHLY recommend you call them to find out the deal.

I just checked my E-mail. Notice from Tower stating my backorder (GTB 5.5 ) shipped on Friday.Should be here by the middle of the week. Can't wait to try it in my TC3, Rustler & B4. I run them all on the street in front of my house.

[AudiTT-Quattro]

I just checked my E-mail. Notice from Tower stating my backorder (GTB 5.5 ) shipped on Friday.Should be here by the middle of the week. Can't wait to try it in my TC3, Rustler & B4. I run them all on the street in front of my house.
Cool, let us know how it works out for you.

[BLRustler]

Will let you know how it runs. Will be using a 3800 SMC battery. My TC3
with a 9 x 2 Cobalt is quite a handfull on the D shaped oval with chicane.
The GTB 5.5 will be fun for sure. :D

[schenck77]

good to see that some people have gotten theres shipped. i know they were listed as in stock, now early september but yet my backorder was not sent out. guess i am just going to have to call them again, and see what is up.

[schenck77]

well tower now has the 6.5 in stock. so I cancelled my 5.5 that is on back order and just ordered the 6.5. Then I went and checked my order history and now it shows my 5.5 as picked and packed, but I cancelled it. Called tower and they said they cant do anything since I cancelled (wouldn't of but the stupid site didnt listed my order as waiting for product until after I ordered the 6.5). so the bottom line is I am getting the novak but apparently the slower one, hope its fast enough.

[glassdoctor]

Oh man... the 6.5 will be really slow, like the 5800. Too bad...



Haha... :)

I'm sure the 6.5 will be smokin fast, not a big difference from a 5.5

I would even say the "milder" motor will be better for like 80% of the guys who buy them cause it will alredy be more than they can handle.

[Tyrael1986]

well tower now has the 6.5 in stock. so I cancelled my 5.5 that is on back order and just ordered the 6.5. Then I went and checked my order history and now it shows my 5.5 as picked and packed, but I cancelled it. Called tower and they said they cant do anything since I cancelled (wouldn't of but the stupid site didnt listed my order as waiting for product until after I ordered the 6.5). so the bottom line is I am getting the novak but apparently the slower one, hope its fast enough.

i dunno, you might get lucky and get both... I've had the same experience with orders and i ended up getting both things i ordered and i only paid for one... :) cross your fingers and wait for the mail!

[Bad Ash]

I was going to hold off for the GTB/5.5 package myself. But instead I bought a used Super Sport Plus and a 5800. I couldn't be happier. It's more than enough for my T4. If I can get the truck to hook up it's a rocket. I don't race it onroad, only offroad. I love the runtimes also. The only way that I would go to the 5.5 right now is if I had lipo's the 5.5 would chew up my 3300's and I would be back to like 5-8minutes of runtime. and way to much power for a 2wd stadium truck. Just my opinion. I race mod class and there are guys that have 12-7 turn motors. and they are all over powered for the small track that we race.

[Mirage one]

Bad Ash, you made the right choice,I know that we all want the ultimate power at all times, the 5.5 and the 6.5 will be great for on road and high traction surfaces, for the guys who are looking to run them off road in T4`s and MF2`s or buggys, you will probably be quite dissapointed when you realise that you can`t put all that power to the dirt and the guys with the 5800`s are doing circles around you. I have tried a few different trucks with the 5800 and with good gearing and a good pack, it is overpowered for all but the biggest track. My 2 cents, lol!

[Tyrael1986]

i was kinda thinking about getting the 5.5 for a T4, but the reasoning wasn't because of the motor itself. it was because of the ESC. I'm not very fond of the SuperSport ESC. and i was basically more interested in the GTX/GT7 ESC's so when the GTB was released it caught my eye.

for people who think about this like i do, we have a question. could we buy a GTB ESC without a motor, and then buy a 5800 motor and run it with the GTB ESC?

[chilledoutuk]

you definatly could as they use the same wireing standard.

What i like about the gtb is that you can put a fan on it to keep it super cool doing this with the sphere does not seem to be possible.

I personaly prefer sensorless

[Tyrael1986]

well, in my case i would be running it in a stadium truck and mostly in dirt/grass so a thermal sensor would probably not kill me... or the truck for that matter. last thing i want to see is my truck smoking because i was running in to deep of grass.. :)
using tower hobbies as a reference can someone post me the product ID numbers that i would need to order to do this? the GTB ESC and whatever the 5800 motor is called.
and one last question, does the GTB ESC come WITH a fan? or do you have to buy it separately?

[AudiTT-Quattro]

You can put a fan on anything. I had a fan on my Super Sport ESC. Not very hard to do. Sure, the Super Sport is not the best ESC in the world but if you put a fan on it, it's always ice cool and I could run back to back practice packs without worrying about the system overheating.

BTW, I've seen the Sphere with a fan threaded on the heatsink which worries me because of the rather weak BEC. Another reason why I'm going with the Novak.

[chilledoutuk]

yes i could stap a fan onto a bannana if i wanted to but the cooling effect would be crap. what i was saying is that there is a nice heatsink for a fan on the gtb

[Tyrael1986]

the GTB shows a heat sink on the pictures... are you saying that you have to buy the heat sink separately? if so how much more cash does that tack onto the total price? and does it come with the fan to put on the heat sink? or do you have to buy that too? jeez.. lol

[SpEEdyBL]

The gtb comes with a heatsink+fan all in one package.

[chilledoutuk]

if the gtb comes with a fan as standard that worries me as it means that novak could have used rubbish FETS.

[Tyrael1986]

if the gtb comes with a fan as standard that worries me as it means that novak could have used rubbish FETS.
that, or it could just be them trying to fix the problems they had before. the SS+ system supposedly had problems overheating, so maybe they did this to prevent that from happening again? i guess we really wont know until we can test them ourselves or find reviews... but at least it comes all in 1 piece :)

[Rtsbasic]

Or it could indicate that they know heat has been a problem with their previous ESC's so don't want to risk it being a problem with this one. In some cars where your very restricted for space/airflow any controller will thermal if you give it long enough.

Or they're used poor quality components, I guess time will tell.

[Gojira]

i think it only comes with a fan if you buy just the esc.They get an extra 10-15$ for the fan and esc alone just look at thier individual prices.the system sells for 240$ the motor 80$ the esc with fan 170$......240$ is towers price ive seen it for 20$ less at hobby people

[Mirage one]

I was corresponding with a Novak employee last week and he said that they had tested the gtb set-up with brushless motors as low as 3.5 turns and it held-up great.I do like the fact that they include a fan,nip possible overheating right in the bud. I do run a fan on my super-sport, works great.

[Tyrael1986]

so they do include the fan in the motor/esc combo system? if so that's good to know. if i do buy it i want to make sure i have it all at once and don't have to order extra things.

[AudiTT-Quattro]

If you spend 30 seconds reading the GTB specs on the Novak website, you'll notice that it comes with a fan mounted.

[tcolesen]

To me, the inclusion of a fan means that the controller is not capable of handling the motor with standard gearing. If Novak knew that it could handle the current that the 5.5 motor requires without overheating, they wouldn't include a fan. It is like selling a 15t brushed esc with a fan just so it could be rated as being capable of handling a 13t motor.

[SpEEdyBL]

People use fans on their brushed esc during racings. And I'm sure they're all using the worst esc ever made. Yup.

[Tyrael1986]

okay, not to be rude. but take your fan off of your CPU on your computer. congratulations you are now using the worst CPU ever made :P

on a other note, just because they include something that isn't necessary doesn't mean that its a bad product. next time you buy a car that has no stereo tell them that... :)

[KylefromVA]

Some people wouldn't buy 1:1 scale cars when they first started being produced with seatbelts. Some people thought because of the added safety precautions the car must be poorly made and just fall apart.

[chilledoutuk]

Tyrael1986 you seem to have missed the point people like myself like the option to run a fan on a esc to give extra cooling allowing tougher gearing etc. If novak are shipping there gtb with a fan either they are being cautious and just giving the esc a bit more cooling or they have had problems with overheating when cooled passively. If its the latter then their GTB is inferior to the LRP Sphere.

Personally id rather get a Decent sensorless controller (sculze, mtroniks, MGM) and hacker c406s but for some stupid reason there not legal to race.

[Mirage one]

The way i understood the gtb having a fan is to be able to handle hotter winds at a latter time, it supposively handles the 5.5 and 6.5 without a sweat!!!Like i said earlier they even tested it with a 3.5 turn and it handled it without problems(that i was told) i guest we can speculate all we want, the people that will find out the thermal limit of this system are the people that will actually buy and use it.

[ffactory666]

I'll be using the GTB 6.5 in a RC10l2 pan car running a 6400mah lipo pack , so i'll be getting at least 20mins runtime to go up against nitro cars.Including the fan for watever the reason behind it by Novak is great as that's one less item i have to buy seperately.
Doesn't matter what ESC i use , i would have to run a fan anyway if running for more than 20 mins without a break.


Before anyone jumps in , i know the GTB is not designed for lipos so i'll be running an external voltage cut off .

[chilledoutuk]

yes i think that was very ignorant of them to ignore lipo users and not put in a couple of lipo voltage cutoff presets into there software.

[Rtsbasic]

Are lipo's legal to use when racing? Didn't think so, thats probably why they didn't bother including lipo cut off (although it would have been nice). Also the fact that the controller is only rated to 6 cell nimh sorta limits how many lipo's you can run.

[tcolesen]

Lipos are legal in some club racing events, like what Craps does. Also, if a track doesn't follow ROAR rules that closely, they may allow Lipos.
It's not that big of a deal to include a cutoff. I am considering selling a LVC device for 2s, 3s, and 4s Lipo that makes the motor stutter, and when the voltage gets low enough, it will stop the motor.

[chilledoutuk]

tcolesen what would the forwad voltage drop over such a device be?

[Rtsbasic]

tcolesen, sounds like a nice little device, would a single device work for 2s/3s/4s or would they be seperate? What sort of pricing are you thinking if you go ahead with it?

I guess lipo's are becoming more accepted at club events, but 98% of people who race use nimh cells, and these are the people the Novak/LRP systems are aimed at so I can't fault them for not including lipo cut off.

[SpEEdyBL]

Lipos give way more of an advantage than brushless motors do. Think about the handling gain due to weight loss and the increase in runtime, and not just sheer power.

[Kyosho Fan]

Towers said today on the phone they never received any GTB "5.5" yet ! What can I say.....this is getting wierd !

[tcolesen]

tcolesen what would the forwad voltage drop over such a device be?

No voltage drop. This device only cuts into the signal wire going from/to the RX/ESC. So, that means that BEC on a ESC can be used.
Unless you mean what the cutoff voltage would be, which is 3v per cell. I could even make them with more or less than 3v/cell if one wished.

tcolesen, sounds like a nice little device, would a single device work for 2s/3s/4s or would they be seperate? What sort of pricing are you thinking if you go ahead with it?

I guess lipo's are becoming more accepted at club events, but 98% of people who race use nimh cells, and these are the people the Novak/LRP systems are aimed at so I can't fault them for not including lipo cut off.

I could make a single device that could be used with 2s/3s/4s Lipo, but that would require 2 extra resistors, and then it would require jumpers to be used (more parts=bigger). As far as pricing, I am thinking about $20 shipped to U.S., but that could certainely change. Most of the cost is just for the connectors! (the connectors to join this device to the ESC, and then have another one go to the RX).

[ElectricThunder]

Towers said today on the phone they never received any GTB "5.5" yet ! What can I say.....this is getting wierd !
Looks like it's a good thing I had to pay car insurance this month and not spend it on the mysterious 5.5....lol! O well, I'll probably buy one for christmas for myself or something, or earlier. Couldn't hurt to see if there's some bugs to work out. :)

[Gojira]

hobby people has the 6.5 for 220$ buy that one then when motors are availible buy a 5.5 motor and have both for diff tracks

[masterdummy]

hobby people has the 6.5 for 220$ buy that one then when rotors are availible buy a 5.5 rotor and have both for diff tracks

what are you saying! rotors in BL motors only carry magnets... :D

[BobNovak]

hobby people has the 6.5 for 220$ buy that one then when rotors are availible buy a 5.5 rotor and have both for diff tracks
It is not the rotor that makes the difference it is the number of turns on the stator that makes the difference.
Bob Novak

[Gojira]

yea i dont know y i wrote rotos i meant motors

[BobNovak]

if the gtb comes with a fan as standard that worries me as it means that novak could have used rubbish FETS.
The GTB uses the lowest RDS on FET's available. For your info that is the resistance of the FET between Drain and Source when it is in its fully on state. We included the fan and heatsink so that the customer can run his GTB under any condition with any motor we make or will make and not have to worry about having to buy anything extra.
Bob Novak

[CharlieS]

My Chevy has a radiator in it, seatbelts, safety glass, airbags, and a spare tire, must mean the engines about to blow, the doors are gonna fall off, the hood will fly up and break the winshield, the car will swerve into a tree, and the tires are bad.

[schenck77]

charles,
now that is funny. I was concerned about the fan too, but it sounds lilke its not really needed except for extreme conditions.

[ElectricThunder]

My Chevy has a radiator in it, seatbelts, safety glass, airbags, and a spare tire, must mean the engines about to blow, the doors are gonna fall off, the hood will fly up and break the winshield, the car will swerve into a tree, and the tires are bad.
Ya may wanna get that checked out then eh? :D

Charlie, I dunno if schenck77 has already asked you, but what's this "super sport upgrade kit"? Is it the rotor/endbell? If so, then get 'em shippin so I can buy one!!!!!!!! :D :p

[aqualato1]

Tower just listed the GTB 6.5 system as "Early Oct." Sorry they are confused. It did say that, now it is saying what it said before, In stock "limited quanities" ;).

[chilledoutuk]

The point I was making was that when an esc that comes with a fan as standard, it means one less thing users can do to enhance the controller’s current capacity if they are having problems.

I would rather buy a controller designed to function perfectly whilst passively cooled so that should it be needed active cooling can be used if overheating issues arise.

I appreciate that novak use HQ Fets, But how many? in the supersport there was only 6fets and no matter how good your fets are if your competitors are using similar quality fets but many more of them then they will have a much higher current capacity in there controllers.

Has anyone compared the gtb to the sphere yet?

[AudiTT-Quattro]

I think the addition of the fan was a last minute idea. I believe it will still function well enough without the fan so it may just be a precautionary measure. The Super Sport ESC is ice cool with a 25mm fan on it and FET temperatures were always around 10 degrees celcius higher than ambient with the addition of the fan. Yes, I've done testing. Cooler is better.

Yes, the Super Sport ESC was rather poorly designed. Six FETs compared to higher end brushless ESCs that consist of five or six times that number.

All this being said, lets wait and see how it performs before judging it.

[Kyosho Fan]

Considering the Sphere, there are rumors on our 12th scale board, well, people also driving touring cars next to Pro10 and 12th scale, that quite some Spheres have broken down....however, be aware, haven't seen it, just read it.

[CharlieS]

Wow, that's a very interesting way to look at it.

How about this. We put the fan in, so your ESC performs better. Just plain and simple, better. It works fine with out the fan, but it works better with it. Its the same reason we have the big caps, not because we can't designe with out them, because we choose to design using them and taking advantage of the performance they offer.

There is No airflow inside an R/C Car. None at all. You put some vent holes in and you can stir the air a little bit. Regular motors have to have fans blowing on them to keep the wires soldered on under extreme, and even regular club racing conditions. Fans will be come very standard as we get faster and faster.

My PC has a fan, doesn't mean it on the verge of breaking down, or that it's using cheaper parts.... just helps performance...... The Best PCs and Fastest PCs and anything that is used for long term, has fans on them. Cooling helps plain and simple weather it is needed or not.

Go feel some heatsinks on these, No Fan Systems.... You'll see what I mean.

[tcolesen]

I can understand how you put this Charlie. From what it seemed to me, the fan is required, as no where had I read that it would be fine without it. I think you guys should make that more clear, as many will think that the esc is junk without one.

[BobNovak]

The point I was making was that when an esc that comes with a fan as standard, it means one less thing users can do to enhance the controller’s current capacity if they are having problems.

I would rather buy a controller designed to function perfectly whilst passively cooled so that should it be needed active cooling can be used if overheating issues arise.

I appreciate that novak use HQ Fets, But how many? in the supersport there was only 6fets and no matter how good your fets are if your competitors are using similar quality fets but many more of them then they will have a much higher current capacity in there controllers.

Has anyone compared the gtb to the sphere yet?
Here are the published specs for the GTB vs the Sphere
The GTB's voltage drop at 20 amps=0.016 volts for brushless motors and 0.0026 volts for brushed motors. The typical voltage drop for the Sphere at 20 amps is 0.035 volts for brushless motors and 0.026 volts for brushed motors.This shows that the GTB has less than 1/2 the voltage drop that the Sphere does at any current level. All other speed controls that we have seen use a power SO-8 FET which use a plastic case. These Fets have a very poor power dissapation and cannot handle the level of current of the type of FET's that we are using. (And yes the GTB has many more FETS than the Super Sport.) They also have twice the on resistance that ours do. The other factor that you are missing is that the cooler the FETS the lower the voltage drop and the faster the system. We make racing speed controls and we do everthing to give the racer the best we can to make him the fastest.
Bob Novak

[tcolesen]

Bob, you should use what you just said as advertising! I know it would sell me... (just don't have the money). I just wish that you guys had included a 2s Lipo LVC circuit!

[scoob]

I have a 6.5 system on the way. It shipped out today from hobbypeople. It's going in a T4 that I race in a "Pro-truck" class here in NC. I use 8000mah Lipos and run 12-20 minute mains depending where I'm racing. This should be a good test of the system. I have been very pleased with the ss5800 in this type of racing, it has held up pretty well. Just gear it a few teeth lower than Novak recommends for the longer mains and it runs like a champ. With the fan, I feel like the GTB may be able to run recommended gearing and be fine in the longer races. I'm very glad the fan is included.

I'm not worried about the voltage cutofff with the 8000 I've never even come close to running it dead.

[OptimaMan]

You run with Craps? Out of curiosity, how much faster is the Extreme and U Force vs. the SS5800 on the track? Or is it pretty much driving abilty?

[scoob]

You run with Craps? Out of curiosity, how much faster is the Extreme and U Force vs. the SS5800 on the track? Or is it pretty much driving abilty?

Well the Plett/U-force is definatelty faster by a good margin. Craps was nice enough to let me drive his for a lap or so, granted I didn't get on it hard because I didin't want to wreck his truck but the truck felt ultra smooth with excellent throttle response from low speed to high speed. Very good torque, the most I've ever seen, yet still very controllable with excellent top-end too. In other words, about as good as it gets :). There are probably faster more powerful setups but this is probably the best all-round for a 1/10th truck. I just can't afford it at this point.Craps has won several races lately at CRCC in our Pro-truck class, beating a pretty large field of electric and Nitro trucks with this setup.
A great driver could definately win the class with the ss5800 though. It's got decent power and all I can use at this point. I'm mainly buying the GTB 6.5 for the ESC, it has some features like drag-brake that I think will help my driving, of course the faster motor is a nice benifit ;)

I'm not a very good driver yet and I know the Extreme/ U-force will not make up for driver abilty.

[Kyosho Fan]

So, can I conclude under "any " circumstance "4 cell 1:12" will not need the fan on the 5.5 system ?

[Izah]

LMAO you just got put in your plase by bob Novak n00b.

[jocktheglide165]

LMAO you just got put in your plase by bob Novak n00b.

well he did didnt he...so many folks put things down before even seeing it or touching they act like they know it all just funny. :p

[TimisTim]

LMAO you just got put in your plase by bob Novak n00b.

Please try to keep the petty comments to the playground. And you misspelled place.

Back to the topic....

I don't think people were putting the system down, just being cautious and voicing it. It is good that Bob and Charlie jumped in and explained a few things about the system and layed out the stats for us.

[Izah]

INDENT]Your right i did misspell place :rolleyes: but that was funny to have Bob Novak of all people catch some one who im sure never thoght was going to be called on what he or she sead. Talking trash about his product. :p

[ElectricThunder]

INDENT]Your right i did misspell place :rolleyes: but that was funny to have Bob Novak of all people catch some one who im sure never thoght was going to be called on what he or she sead. Talking trash about his product. :p
Who cares? This thread is about the system, not who got "told" by Bob.;)

Anyways, like Tim said, I think it's cool that Bob and Charlie lurk around here every so often. If I have a question, usually Charlie gets to it, which is great. Saves me the time of dialing up Novak..:D

[CharlieS]

Don't forget, we've got email too....

tech@teamnovak.com.... :)

[chilledoutuk]

Who the hell are you calling a noob "IZAH".

I didnt get told by bob I simply backed him into a corner so that he would tell me more about there new system and convice me they havent cut corners like with the ss controller.

My concern was valid but now it seems that novak has learnt from the ss problems and pulled out all the stops to make sure this controller is a hit.

I also think that it would be wise to add a LVC for 2s lipo to the software on the controller as this will make your product much more attractive to lipo powered bashers.

[TimisTim]

Well there is always software upgrading ;)

We can blame the racing sanctions for the non-lipo software. Novak is really streamlined for the racing community. Which is kind of weird because from what I was told 90% of the products sold don't set ummmmmm......tire.....on the track.

[chilledoutuk]

the rules forbid controllers that have a low voltage cut-off for lipos how ludicrous!!

I suppose they could offer a basher software if you have a pc link.

[ElectricThunder]

Don't forget, we've got email too....

tech@teamnovak.com.... :)
Yeah, but why email when I can just pester your on here or via PMs?:D ;)

And the way RC is headed right now chilled, I have a feeling the rules will HAVE to open up to allow lipos sooner or later. I mean, they're taking over slowly but surely. Only time will tell I guess?

[cart213]

Has anybody received their GTB yet? I want to see some reviews!

[JakeE]

Has anybody received their GTB yet? I want to see some reviews!

I received mine last week and ran it in my BJ4 over the weekend. Do you have any specific questions?

[ElectricThunder]

I received mine last week and ran it in my BJ4 over the weekend. Do you have any specific questions?
Any heat issues? How was top end? How was torque? Was it a 5.5 or 6.5?:D That's all I can think of right now.

[JakeE]

I'm using the 6.5 motor. Torque seemed strong, I won't have a good idea of top end until tomorrow night when I'll be racing on a much bigger track. We ran three 6 minute heats and one 8 minute main on Sunday and the motor never exceeded 140° F while the heatsink on the GTB never went above 135° F and this was before I had thought to cut ventilation holes in the body.

[CharlieS]

Man. I love the internet.

[ElectricThunder]

I'm using the 6.5 motor. Torque seemed strong, I won't have a good idea of top end until tomorrow night when I'll be racing on a much bigger track. We ran three 6 minute heats and one 8 minute main on Sunday and the motor never exceeded 140° F while the heatsink on the GTB never went above 135° F and this was before I had thought to cut ventilation holes in the body.
That's impressive. Thanks for the "review". But wow, only 135F? My SS runs at around 170-185ish or so (never actually checked it, but sometimes it's on the edge of thermaling). This just confirms that the GTB is a strong ESC. ME WANT ONE!:D

[aqualato1]

I'm using the 6.5 motor. Torque seemed strong, I won't have a good idea of top end until tomorrow night when I'll be racing on a much bigger track. We ran three 6 minute heats and one 8 minute main on Sunday and the motor never exceeded 140° F while the heatsink on the GTB never went above 135° F and this was before I had thought to cut ventilation holes in the body.

how does the 6.5 GTB

[JakeE]

I'll try to get some temp readings after tomorrow nights race when I can wind the system out fully for several laps on a bigger track.

[aqualato1]

I'm using the 6.5 motor. Torque seemed strong, I won't have a good idea of top end until tomorrow night when I'll be racing on a much bigger track. We ran three 6 minute heats and one 8 minute main on Sunday and the motor never exceeded 140° F while the heatsink on the GTB never went above 135° F and this was before I had thought to cut ventilation holes in the body.

How does the 6.5 GTB system compare to the 8.5 system?

[JakeE]

Someone else will have to chime in with a GTB 6.5 vs SS+ 8.5 comparo, the GTB 6.5 is the first tenth scale brushless system I've used.

[ElectricThunder]

How does the 6.5 GTB system compare to the 8.5 system?
Just from parts and ESC difference, the 6.5 romps all over the 8.5. More torque, more top end, and a cooler ESC. First hand side-by-side performance test-wise, I dunno, don't have the GTB to compare (oh how I wish I did...:D, it's time to start taking money out of each paycheck again!).

[aqualato1]

Would anyone know what a good starting gear set up would be on a Evader ST with the 5.5 GTB?

The Novak website says an assoc. T4 truck should be 87/15-16. So could that apply to the Evader?

[CharlieS]

Probably pretty close, the manual also gives the "final drive" information, you can use that the same way.

[Farwar]

So far it sounds like a good system. This might be my first brushless system and I was wondering how big of a difference will I feel from a speed gem 15t to the 5.5 gtb?(In terms of toque and speed)

[chilledoutuk]

woh from a 15t to a 5.5 you will be blown away this should perfrorm something like a 9turn brushed.

With my c40 8s i have to be carefull as if i accelerate and turn too hard the car grip rolls madely but i think that might have a lot to do with the supper grippy natural rubber tires i run on my academy sb.

[JakeE]

Here's an update after practice tonight on a much bigger track (not enough cars for a 4WD class):

I've got my BJ4 geared 17/72 using the GTB 6.5 system, I'm not sure if it was topping out on the long front straight but it was very quick.

After dumping a 6 cell GP3700 pack, the motor was at 145° F vs the 140° F I was reading on a track approx. 1/3 the size last weekend. The big surprise (to me at least) was the GTB heatsink temp, it was only running between 115°-120° F (135° F last weekend on the smaller track) - I didn't believe it at first so I took several more readings from different angles at different points on the heatsink. Perhaps the GTB is more efficient when the motor is run at higher RPM, though thats just my guess.

Overall I'm very impressed :)

[AudiTT-Quattro]

The problem with reading temperatures from the heatsink with the fan on makes the results deceiving. All you're really proving is that the aluminum with the fan on is a very good thermal conductor through Newton's Law of Cooling. A cool heatsink doesn't mean cool FETs especially if you're only reading the surface temperature of the heatsink.

Taking the temperature of the ESC without the fan is a much better basis. BTW, ambient temperature is huge in determining whether a temperature is nominal or not.

Just a little FYI...

[badboy2]

wil lany of those gtb work on emaxx?

[Bad Ash]

I'd like to know if the fan/heatsink will fit on the older SS + esc's :D If not anyone know of a fan that will work on this heatsink? and where do you solder the leads to?

[ElectricThunder]

wil lany of those gtb work on emaxx?
No. It'd fry.

Bad Ash- Pick up one of Novak's 25x25x10mm fans (5v dc) from tower for about 13 bucks. Solder on radio leads according to the receiver you use and plug it into an empty Rx slot, or use a Y-harness to plug it into the same slot as the ESC, screw the fan into the SS's heatsink, and BAM, you got cooling. It helps quite a bit.

[CharlieS]

I've also connected the fan to the actual input harness of the ESC. It's got plugs on both ends, you can slide the metal "pin" out of the black connector and wedge the fan power wires in the little cradle thats left from the original wires being crimped on. Then its barely noticed.

Smaller tracks make for hotter ESCs because you have to accellerate more often. Moving a car from stop/slow to medium speeds uses the most current.

[scoob]

I just got my GTB 6.5 installed in my T4. Setup was super easy, as I've come to expect/appreciate from Novak. I hooked up my TP8000lipo for a little back yard test. As expected the thing is very fast. With the Lipo it was wheely time! Any time the truck hooked up the front end launched skyward, although the Lipo has a lot more punch than any 6 cell I've tried. Good thing I have trouble hooking up on the track or I'd be flipping out! I'm using a 16t pinion. Top end looked good but I really have no where to open it up. I'm coming off of the 5800 and there is definatley a great deal more power here. The 5800 in now in the B4 where it is an aboslute rocket.

I love the little fan, it's so cool and the drag brake is awesome! With the 5800 i would get on the throttle and have to brake hard but with the GTB the drag brake slows the truck smoothly.

I decided to put it up after I cartwheeled the truck. I was mooving along on gravel about 1/4 throttle, jammed the throttle down, found traction, front end came up, hit ground and bounced sending the truck flipping lol. Mega power! I'm very pleased.

[ElectricThunder]

I just got my GTB 6.5 installed in my T4. Setup was super easy, as I've come to expect/appreciate from Novak. I hooked up my TP8000lipo for a little back yard test. As expected the thing is very fast. With the Lipo it was wheely time! Any time the truck hooked up the front end launched skyward, although the Lipo has a lot more punch than any 6 cell I've tried. Good thing I have trouble hooking up on the track or I'd be flipping out! I'm using a 16t pinion. Top end looked good but I really have no where to open it up. I'm coming off of the 5800 and there is definatley a great deal more power here. The 5800 in now in the B4 where it is an aboslute rocket.

I love the little fan, it's so cool and the drag brake is awesome! With the 5800 i would get on the throttle and have to brake hard but with the GTB the drag brake slows the truck smoothly.

I decided to put it up after I cartwheeled the truck. I was mooving along on gravel about 1/4 throttle, jammed the throttle down, found traction, front end came up, hit ground and bounced sending the truck flipping lol. Mega power! I'm very pleased.
Sounds like a freakish little powerhouse....:D How would you rate/compare/describe the torque difference between the 5800 and 6.5R? Is all out power THAT noticeable if you're not racing and just bashing around? :confused:

[BobNovak]

the rules forbid controllers that have a low voltage cut-off for lipos how ludicrous!!

I suppose they could offer a basher software if you have a pc link.
I don't know of any rules that forbid speed controllers from having a low voltage cutoff for Lipo batteries. The only rule I know is that Lipo batteries are not approved for any ROAR or IFMAR sanctioned races. There is talk within ROAR about these batteries (see the Competition Directors column in the Augest-September issue of Rev Up). If you are not a member of Roar you can read his column on the Roar website at WWW.ROARracing.com. Also remember only you, the Roar member, can affect ruling changes by letting ROAR know what you think.
Bob Novak

[scoob]

Acually it's tough to compare just by my little test. It doesn't seem to have a great deal more torque than the 5800 on the bottom, the 5800 is pretty strong there but as the rpms climb the power comes on much harder. Kinda like it has more midrange punch, I don't know how else to describe it.As I said I haven't seen top speed yet or anywhere close. Also the 2s4p TP8000 lipo gives it more power than it would have on 6 cells, at least it did with the 5800 and I expect this to be the case with the 6.5.

[ElectricThunder]

Acually it's tough to compare just by my little test. It doesn't seem to have a great deal more torque than the 5800 on the bottom, the 5800 is pretty strong there but as the rpms climb the power comes on much harder. Kinda like it has more midrange punch, I don't know how else to describe it.As I said I haven't seen top speed yet or anywhere close. Also the 2s4p TP8000 lipo gives it more power than it would have on 6 cells, at least it did with the 5800 and I expect this to be the case with the 6.5.
Cool, thanks scoob. More midrange power is always nice. :D

[scoob]

Well, I had time for a better test today and opened it up. Top speed is impressive. It seems about 20% aster than the 5800 on top speed. I'm using the 16 tooth pinion and Novak recommends 16-17 so there's a little more to be had. I don't think i'll need it on my track though.

I was wrong about the low-end too. It has more than the 5800. Turns out my slipper wasn't tight enough to handle the extra punch. I tightened it a little and it's wicked off the botom. The midrange punch I was getting was the slipper slipping and then catching sending the front end skyward.

[ElectricThunder]

Well, I had time for a better test today and opened it up. Top speed is impressive. It seems about 20% aster than the 5800 on top speed. I'm using the 16 tooth pinion and Novak recommends 16-17 so there's a little more to be had. I don't think i'll need it on my track though.

I was wrong about the low-end too. It has more than the 5800. Turns out my slipper wasn't tight enough to handle the extra punch. I tightened it a little and it's wicked off the botom. The midrange punch I was getting was the slipper slipping and then catching sending the front end skyward.
Now THAT is absolutely beautiful information....:D (starts saving up moola!)

[GordonFreeman]

Lipos give way more of an advantage than brushless motors do. Think about the handling gain due to weight loss and the increase in runtime, and not just sheer power.

I'll take any opportunity to show off my 550 gram Mamba ESC, HiMax 2025-4200, Twin LiPo (850mAh 3 cells) powered 1/12 scale. With moderate gearing I would estimate about 50MPH. It's insane.

[aqualato1]

About how fast do you think the 5.5 GTB system will make a 1/10 stadium truck go?

[GordonFreeman]

My Chevy has a radiator in it, seatbelts, safety glass, airbags, and a spare tire, must mean the engines about to blow, the doors are gonna fall off, the hood will fly up and break the winshield, the car will swerve into a tree, and the tires are bad.

Yeah, but your old gasoline car engine is like 25% efficent so it needs to dump all that extra energy overboard (granted most is out the exhaust).

Are you saying you need a giant heatsink and a fan for safety factor?

Don't get me wrong, my 5.5 is on order. But why can other brushless ESCs get away without any heatsink? (I'll list them if you want, but I know this is a Novak thread so I won't)

[Rtsbasic]

What other car brushless ESC's operate correctly without the heatsink? My Mtroniks is sealed into one, U-Force, MGM's, Warrior's all have them. The one on the LRP is optional but pretty much required from what I've read.

[GordonFreeman]

Mamba.

This is kind of old news but should be interesting:

http://www.castlecreations.com/documents/pressreleases/Mamba%20Max%20ESC.pdf

I have not seen specs yet, but considering none of the medium size Castle BL ESCs have heatsinks, I can't imagine this one would either.

I'm not saying the Novak is bad, Like I said, mine is on order :) Just wondering what Castle is doing that allows them to not have a big heat sink.

[Rtsbasic]

The mamba handle what, 25 amps current, 50 peaks? The big Mamba has heatsinks IIRC. There's some pics of prototype ones floating around somewhere.

[GordonFreeman]

The mamba handle what, 25 amps current, 50 peaks? The big Mamba has heatsinks IIRC. There's some pics of prototype ones floating around somewhere.

Right, but do the bigger Castle BL ESCs have heatsinks? I don't know, can't see from the pics.

And 25 amps at 12 volts is 300W! A lot for a 500 gram car, just depends on the application.

I know the big heatsink on the SS caused plenty of failures for Novak because of what happens during a crash, the heatsink would just about rip the top board off the bottom board and would damage the board connector/jumper. A bad design on the case and connector IMO. Also that big mass would cause fatigue failures on that same connector.

As long as it works, it's light and compact, I'm there. From the pictures of the new GTB they have more robustly attached the heatsink through the entire case.

[TimisTim]

I dont think Castle has a controller made with car software besides the new Maxx and the mamba. The rest of their stuff is made for planes or boats. I know most planes dont pull that much current so they wont have the heat problems cars do with their constant acceleration AND braking current. All of the high power boats have water cooled esc's, and Castle makes a few of them.

And yes the Mamba Maxx has a huge heat sink right on top like the UF75.....only bigger! The fact is electronics work more efficently when cooler.....period. So why not put a little more money into a product to have it work alot better.

Take a look at the Mamba Maxx here (http://www.the-rc-zone.com/events/rcx2005/gallery.php)

[glassdoctor]

About how fast do you think the 5.5 GTB system will make a 1/10 stadium truck go?

Just an educated guess would put it somewhere in the around 40 with typical gearing for a race setup. But with a higher gear adn esp. with 7 cells I'm sure getting over 50 is very possible... maybe even easy. We won't really know until some experiment with them.

BTW, off topic... I clocked my 1/8 buggy at 53.6mph today. :eek: but the esc kept shutting off due to either excessive voltage or current. :rolleyes:

As for the BigMamba... I think the pics from the hobby show looked like there was a heatsink on it. Stop dogging on the new Novak at least until we get it... why all the smack for something we haven't seen or used?

[GordonFreeman]

Ok, well I won't wait for the Mamba Maxx, that thing looks nasty. I'm just looking to find the fastest/cheapest way around a carpet track (outside the rules!). Maybe I'm over-obsessing about weight. But with added weight you need more power, more power you need more amps/volt, more amps you need a bigger ESC, a bigger ESC adds more weight, ect....Just looking for that perfect compromise. The power system (ESC,Motor,Battery) in my 1/12 cost me about $150, dropped 40% of the vehicle weight and the thing is ballistic. Just looking to see if it can be done cheaper and faster.

[aqualato1]

Just an educated guess would put it somewhere in the around 40 with typical gearing for a race setup. But with a higher gear adn esp. with 7 cells I'm sure getting over 50 is very possible... maybe even easy. We won't really know until some experiment with them.

BTW, off topic... I clocked my 1/8 buggy at 53.6mph today. :eek: but the esc kept shutting off due to either excessive voltage or current. :rolleyes:

As for the BigMamba... I think the pics from the hobby show looked like there was a heatsink on it. Stop dogging on the new Novak at least until we get it... why all the smack for something we haven't seen or used?
I thought the GTB esc was limited two 4-6 1.2/volt cells?

[GroundPounder30]

I've got the 5.5 in my T4, geared per manufacturer recommendations (87/16), I verified the speed at 40.1mph (with Garmin GPS) running unmatched gp3700 pack, and a pair of bald Proline Lugnutz. I did also pop in an 18t pinion and clocked it at 42.8mph, but didn't run a whole pack that way, as I don't want to push too much too soon. I'm perfectly happy with 40+ on 6 cells anytime!!

[GroundPounder30]

It is 4-6 cells only, I'm sure people will probably "experiment" with 7+ cells, not me, I spent too much on this thing to test fate.

[aqualato1]

Does anyone know if the GTB esc can hadle li-po cells?

[ElectricThunder]

Does anyone know if the GTB esc can hadle li-po cells?
My guess is yes, as long as it's a 2s pack, and you have an external low voltage cutoff device. The FETs should be rated to around 30v, so an 8.4ish freshly charged 2s lipo pack should be fine to use. Just a guess though.

[aqualato1]

My guess is yes, as long as it's a 2s pack, and you have an external low voltage cutoff device. The FETs should be rated to around 30v, so an 8.4ish freshly charged 2s lipo pack should be fine to use. Just a guess though.
What would be the run time on a 2s lip-po?

[tcolesen]

Depends on the capacity. A 8000mah pack will give twice the runtime of a 4000mah pack.

One thing I don't understand is why the GTB doesn't have a low-cutoff built in for 2s Lipo packs. Even if they aren't race legal, people using the GTB for bashing may want to use Lipos without paying extra for a LVC device.

[schenck77]

I totally agree with tcolesen, that is the only complaint I have about the gtb system.

[ElectricThunder]

Depends on the capacity. A 8000mah pack will give twice the runtime of a 4000mah pack.

One thing I don't understand is why the GTB doesn't have a low-cutoff built in for 2s Lipo packs. Even if they aren't race legal, people using the GTB for bashing may want to use Lipos without paying extra for a LVC device.
My guess is that Novak aimed this at racers, who are going to use NiMH cells for a bit longer. It'd be great to see a lipo ready GTB or something though.

[tcolesen]

It would be such a simple thing to add. Maybe we can push Novak to make a firmware upgrade for those that want to use Lipos to incorporate a LVC into the controller. Or if extra hardware would be needed to do it, they could build a special "Lipo ready" version of the GTB controller.

[SpEEdyBL]

If you look at any of the magazines or go to a local hobbies shop, you'll find very little if any lipo equipment for rc cars. Rc car action did one test with the scorpion packs, making it seem like a technology just unearthed. Most people in this hobby don't even know that lipos exist. Only a very small percentage of the rc community runs lipo.

[tcolesen]

But Novak would be ahead in the future for including this option. In comparison to brushed, not many run brushless either. We all know that brushless/Lipo will be the future of RC car racing, and I would think that if Novak could get a jumpstart on this, their future profits could be higher.

[AudiTT-Quattro]

By the time Lipo really starts to kick in, Novak will have a new system out with half a dozen already under their belts.

[vad]

Novak use to manufacture and sell lipo packs... Do you guys remember what happen with that? That could be one reason for not including LVC for lipo batteries, they don't want to deal with the problems of Lipos.

[Mirage one]

If i remember well, Novak had a recall on thoses Li-Pos.I think it is posted on their site.

[elcid4300]

Not a real big deal..but they were actaully lithium ions.

[aqualato1]

What is going on with tower? I placed a GTB 5.5 system on back oder when it said it would be in stock in mid sept. When mid september came around it changed to late sept. so I waited and now it's saying early Oct. How long am I to wait? :confused:

Thanks.

[eggman]

My guess is yes, as long as it's a 2s pack, and you have an external low voltage cutoff device. The FETs should be rated to around 30v, so an 8.4ish freshly charged 2s lipo pack should be fine to use. Just a guess though.

Isn't the GTB series rated for 4 to 6 cells ? Using a 2s Lipo pack would be equivalent to a 7 cell pack if I'm correct. Larry.

[GordonFreeman]

A 2s LiPo packs actual highest voltage is 8.4 (or so). A 6 cell Sub-C freshly charged pack can be 9 to 10v (under load will be 7.2).