Kyosho Lazer ZX-5 4WD off-road buggy

[StevePond]

http://www.rccaraction.com/pics/kyosho/lazerzx5.jpg


Kyosho has released a new top-of-the-line competition off-road buggy, the ZX-5. It's hard to see any details with the body on, but it appears this buggy, like the touring car, includes a shaft-drive system with components from the FW-05R nitro touring machine. If so, the efficiency of the shaft drive system, the bullet-proof diffs of the nitro car, and the wide variety of diff options that already exist should make this a tough competitor in the 4WD class. No word yet on price or availability.


Thanks to Judge for the tip

[Racer Rob]

Hope it makes it to the states. Looks like it could be a nice machine.

[Cain]

Holy crap! Looks like 4wd could be making a big comeback!

[Fantom 15 gt]

wow now that is nice!

[anothermbdusted]

dang thats a sweet looking 4wd and im with you cain i hope this makes the 4wd class more popular

[ExtremeDuty]

The ZX is fianlly.... :D
I have been waiting for its resurrection since it's death of mid 90's.
Well, I could be wrong 'casue I heard Japan still had ZX series all time while U.S. didn't get any due to lack of market interest...

[Cain]

I am excited to see this come here if it does. More options the better. Can't wait to see a final spec and pic of the Academy SB Pro also.

[RichieRich]

I want one! This one looks fully hopped up with carbon fiber and threaded shocks. I wonder if they will make a base version and a modified version? I hope it makes it here to the US.

[StevePond]

The information I have is that this is a protoype that was raced in the JMRCA Nationals in Japan. I would like to see this one make it to production. I think it would be a good car. We'll see...

[kanevil]

1/10 4WD is definitely coming back, and I cant wait!!!

[YR4Dude]

Speaking for my other colleagues on the Lazer ZXR thread, we are all happy to see the Lazer make a come back to the RC world.

I and many others have been faithful to this wonderful 4whl car that was much ahead of its time when it was released. I am hoping that it would be priced reaonable with other 4WD kits out there so that it can gain popularity among the masses.

However, despite the recent success of Academy buggy, we should NOT expect the Kyosho to be priced the same. For all of us who are fans of Kyosho products, we all know of the quality and durability Kyosho builds into their competition kits (ie V One series, FW-05, Kanai buggies, etc). So lets all not get sticker shocked if the kit rolls around the 300-400 price range. :eek:

But, if it hits $600 like the last time, you'll know that the extra money isn't going into Kyosho's pocket!! :mad: Lets hope the distributor doesn't mess it up for this buggie's chances to make to your local track. ;)

[Cain]

Academy did give a kick in the pants on the price side of things with the price for there budget 4wd vehicle. I wonder how low they will go with the Pro?

If Kyosho can keep it around the price of the Losi and include a oneway system as well, I think it will do quite well in the US Market. There is a demand here, just need more options to spark the interest.

[RichieRich]

However, despite the recent success of Academy buggy, we should NOT expect the Kyosho to be priced the same. For all of us who are fans of Kyosho products, we all know of the quality and durability Kyosho builds into their competition kits (ie V One series, FW-05, Kanai buggies, etc). So lets all not get sticker shocked if the kit rolls around the 300-400 price range. :eek:

But, if it hits $600 like the last time, you'll know that the extra money isn't going into Kyosho's pocket!! :mad: Lets hope the distributor doesn't mess it up for this buggie's chances to make to your local track. ;)


It will not surprise me if the price is crazy. Remember the old Optima Mid and Turbo Optima Mid? There were very expensive at the time. I believe the Turbo sold for well over $300 back in 1990 or so. Hopefully Towerhobbies doesn't overprice the buggy. They haven't had a good run in a while. Tower priced the new Ultima RB pretty high unless you got it when it went on clearance. (Which I did. :) )

[MaximumF350]

Carbon fiber chassis? Will that work for off-road racing?

[losiguy1090]

unless its like 5 mm itd prolly crack under any jump over a foot. when i saw this forum, im like oh crap kyosho is already coming out w/ a new 1/8 buggy :rolleyes: lol looks pretty nice

[sosidge]

Carbon fibre works fine as a chassis.

Great big holes around the edges because the body is from an old design car don't help though... Get ready for plenty of post race cleaning with that prototype!

Kyosho have a good looking shaft-drive chassis there - gearboxes look like the FW-05 - wonder how heavy the whole setup is though...

[robert L.]

yea...carbon fiber works fine...look at the BJ4

[StevePond]

unless its like 5 mm itd prolly crack under any jump over a foot

Where do you get this stuff?! Woven graphite chassis plates have been used for years in off-road and they're very effective and durable.

[NitroBoy24]

Looks like 4wd buggies are getting a lot more popular :)

That graphite chassis looks awesome..Man I like graphite :D

[losiguy1090]

steve, well ive never seen an offroad w/ a woven graphite chassis and ive read that onroads w/ woven chassis are prone to getting tweaked so i just assumed. my bad :(

[Beniscool6]

forget all this garbage w/ mini cars, race cars are where all the funs at. this car looks pretty bad ass and the closest think to a associated (that i could actually buy)

[kevbot]

here's pics of it with the body off. it looks NICE to me.

http://homepage3.nifty.com/ksrclifestyle/kyoshoproto.htm

whoever could read that, if there's any info on a release date on there, tell us.

[losiguy1090]

wow! looks awesome. but hopefullly it wont be priced like all the other kyoshos :rolleyes: :p

[Cain]

One thing I wonder is how they handle adjusting the slipper. Is it externally adjustable without having to remove anything? The thing I like about the Academy is once you loosen the top deck you can flex the chassis alittle and it will come out with the way I have it set ( if you do it the stock method, you don't have to do anything to get it out, just pull the shaft out ).

This could sell and there would be a market for it if they can keep the price reasonable.

[docman2]

One thing you can count on with Kyosho is the price will be way too high. They always are. You have to wait a year or so for the thing not to sell(because of price) before you can catch it from Tower on inventory reduction as stated earlier. Its really a shame they always price themselves out of the market.

[Cain]

agreed on that. I was looking into there KX-One as something different sedan wise as I heard it actually was pretty good, but the price at the time was way too high for what I was willing to pay. Took a look as they were clearing them out and they had them marked down to $100. if the parts weren't so costly, I would have picked it up.

[anothermbdusted]

It is KYOSHO プロト of rumor! Shaft drive 4WD off load car. The slipper - it is the clutch and center one-way equipment!

They are around the front. Those of "FW05" of GP touring are used for the gear box.
Ball connecting type is used in the suspension holder.
The suspension arm, the hub carrier, ZXS whose reliability is high - using the steering arm those of EVO. Durability is high, is!

It is the photograph of the chassis section. The battery on front and back has become movement possible by changing the position of the battery post.
It has hidden in the shade of the upper deck, but the propeller shaft is dry dock bone type. Don't you think? is because is not spoiled the chassis roll. The blue alumite caught.
Chassis width is tight very. Still because of prototype the battery slot and the motor slot have remained in only NC processing.
As for motor helicopter loading site right side. Don't you think? is in order to deny the counter torque of the motor.
Don't you think? it is main current of the recent shaft drive car. The slipper of double disk type - equipping the clutch in the spur-gear section.
This part, still being to be development stage, when there is modification schedule, was thing.

Equipping center one way on front gear box side.
Both the center shaft the blue alumite catching, it increases! カッコイイ! !

It is the photograph around the rear. Those of hobby show the diff. cup were デルリン, but this is the steel make!
Approximately also as for the upper arm adjustment of height is possible. Furthermore you installed and several places there was also a position.
This, ZXS - using the suspension arm and the rear hub those of EVO. Don't you think? approximately also as for direction it is opposite.
Don't you think? method of installing the wing stay is unique. With changing the thickness of the color between the damper stay
Front and back position of the wing stay can be adjusted. In addition, also the low new wing stay is in the midst of developing when.
In addition, reinforcement had entered into the damper stay.

The additional plate was installed in the rear hub. Furthermore you acquire rod installation position outside and have become the れ る way.

It is the photograph from front top. Fine control the camber change quantity with changing the height of the upper rod.
Don't you think? the damper case recently is スレイテッドタイプ of popularity.
Using the steering linkage those of アルティマ. With plate system it has been gone.
It is designed in such a way that Ackermann can adjust with the rod of center.
In addition, "KX - the plate of ONE" has been added to the steering arm.

It is the photograph from true rear. Approximately also it has become the suspension holder of the type which is inserted from front and back.
ZXS - Also EVO is this type, but this one has improved setting width of the underside markedly.
Also the stabilizer had tested the thickness of several types.

We want this machine marketing quickly and converting don't you think? is! !


You participated in "ヨコモ off load championship" of the other day, "KYOSHO プロト" of the Mikame player
撮 And others you could point to the photograph.
The body is well-known BRG. Super カッコイイ! !

Basically 2 3 the machine it seems that is not the change.
Are those where it is conspicuous probably the motor heat sink?
Also running was splendid, acceleration and the corner ring speed which shaft drive seem impressive!

[robert L.]

ooh man that is SWEET!!!...wonder what the price will be....i hope the sales for this are good so maybe AE will decide to get in the market....now theres gonna be some new competition for Losi ;)

[relayer]

Wow! There's a lot of new threads about this car all over the net.

I've got a few pics if anyone wants them. They got 2 or 3 of the prototypes in to the A-Main of this years Japanese Nationals, which also contained a few of the old Lazers, which are still competative in their native country.

[Pro3/nmt105]

Get the car direct from HK or Japan and it will be much cheaper. Tower (Great Planes) is the only US distributer of Kyosho so they price everything up alot.

[tarheelquality]

There is no reason it couldn't be priced competitively, If Kyosho can do it with Nitro then it can happen with electric. Just have to get Great Planes(Tower) to behave.

[psbarger]

Whats the issue on price? Unless its more than the BJ4 ($450, now, soon to be $500), I don't think it'll be that outragous. Gotta pay the price to play with the best.

[tarheelquality]

I dont see a lot of BJ4s around here, 450 for an electric car is a bit high, 250-300 is reasonable. Price it around the same as the Losi and people will buy, price between the XXX4 and the MRC car and it will sell like crazy because no one does quality like Kyosho. What they really need to do is what they did with the original Optima put out a good base model at a reasonable price that can be raced then a top of the line maxed out one for the hard core. In the 80's the base Optimas were not that much higher than 2wd and the Turbo was only a small step up from the RC10 or Turbo Ultima.

[tarheelquality]

If you want Kyosho to bring this here fill out one of their suggestion forms here http://www.kyosho.com/suggestion.html . maybe with enough response we will finaly get the good stuff here.

[relayer]

If your interested, i posted a few more pics on the Lazer thread on this forum. More to come too!

[mwcet8k]

unless its like 5 mm itd prolly crack under any jump over a foot.
You're way wrong there. My first "real" R/C car was an RC10 Graphite. It was based on the original RC10, except that it had a SINGLE deck woven graphite chassis. It was basically just a flat piece of carbon fiber with the front end kicked up and it was rock solid.

[losiXXXman]

Exciting development, cannot wait to see if it makes it here to the states..

[RCMadMatt]

That's a lot better looking buggy than the Losi XXX-4 buggy IMO. Gonna have to try it out eventually. :D

Matt

[Cain]

I have seen the BJ4x4 up close and running and it performs. For those who want it all in one shot, the BJ4x4 has it there . Losi does have competition right now, from the BJ4x4 and the Academy SB. Thing is getting the great drivers behind the wheel to duke it out with the Losi guys. But at the local track level, these buggies have been turning heads. The Kyosho if they release it here should do the same. I just hope this 4wd Revival keeps up.

[tarheelquality]

The only problem with the BJ4 is it cost almost as much as a 1/8th buggy. If they would get the price down to that of the Losi there would be some real competition, and as great as the SB sounds it dose not have good distribution out here on the East coastthat I can find, maybe the West coast is different but you can't even find it listed at any of the online stores.

[RichieRich]

tarheelquality - Man, you only pop out when they're is a Kyosho thread. :) :p Anyways, I totally agree. I actually signed up for the BJ4 and the price was just too much. You can purchase nearly 3 SB Sports for the same price.

[Cain]

I am currently ( moving this weekend ironically ) on the east coast. You can contact your LHS and ask them to order it for you from MRC. as far as online mail order, best place I have seen it has been ultimatehobbies but you have to call them. Goes for $145 shipped to your door.

The BJ4x4 has some additions that if added to the losi makes the prices closer together from what I understand, but it doesn't come with any tires. And I know people will say that you probably will ditch them but that should then be reflected in the price. Tires can run you about $20 bucks for a set, any little bit helps. But if pure performance out of the box is your thing, you won't be dissapointed with it. The SB needs a few things but hopefully that all will be addressed with the Pro.

The Kyosho if they can keep that price down can gain a following for sure. I hope they do come out with a team version of this, would go a long way towards gaining interest in the vehicle.

[FLYBOY7]

dont' forget to order wheel bearings, real shocks, and the upgrade motor mount when you order an Academy... this brings the total of the MRC to about the price of the Losi... do not even think the SB Sport is in the same league as a Losi bone stock... you are going to have to dump at least a C-note in upgrades to be even be runable...

[tarheelquality]

Richierich,
I pop out on the Kyosho ones because I still have a Turb Optima and have had a total of about 5 different optimas and a Lazer and still think they are awesome cars. You know you never forget your first love! Also it just seemed that in '91 when I joined the Navy Kyosho was stil at the top in Electric and then 5 years later when I tried to get back into RC Kyosho had disappeared from electric off road Competition in the US, found out later that they were still going ok overseas but nothing here. I realize alot of that may have had to do with exchange rates but I still hated to see it ad would love to see them back in Electric off road. Besides I have owned a couple of Losi's and they just did not apeal to me except maybe the Rally Weapon which was just pure fun. I have alwasy liked the Kyosho and Tamiya cars, they just seem to put some of the little extra touches into their manufacturing that appeal to me.

[tarheelquality]

I do wish it was belt though, nice simple single belt would be nice, seems eveyone is going Shaft now but Losi so I guess it is a forlorn hope.

[silly_boi]

well, i'd hope it's a belt too.. i was hoping for a development of KX-One, not a all new sedan with shaft (like everyone else).. guess it's just the trend to have shaft now.

[relayer]

silly boi,

I got some pics of a n off road KX one which is superb - but for some reason I can't attach pictures on this thread only??

[RichieRich]

Richierich,
I pop out on the Kyosho ones because I still have a Turb Optima and have had a total of about 5 different optimas and a Lazer and still think they are awesome cars.

They are awesome cars. It's funny though, I put my Turbo Optima next to my SB Sport and then I realized how far 4WD technology has progressed: more efficient drive trains, better suspensions and lighter materials. It really is amazing.

[relayer]

Errr...careful about that "more efficient drivetrains" remark.

It is only the improvements in materials that has improved the quality and efficiency of r/c cars in general. Remember all the various drive train, chassis, and suspension configurations have all been done many times before, sometimes better designed than current cars, however the poorer quality components have meant that those earlier designs were never realised properly.

And I've got plenty of pictures to prove how old some ideas are... ;)

[RichieRich]

Errr...careful about that "more efficient drivetrains" remark.

It is only the improvements in materials that has improved the quality and efficiency of r/c cars in general. Remember all the various drive train, chassis, and suspension configurations have all been done many times before, sometimes better designed than current cars, however the poorer quality components have meant that those earlier designs were never realised properly.

And I've got plenty of pictures to prove how old some ideas are... ;)

No, I mean exactly what I said. I was comparing a Turbo Optima to an SB Sport. A Turbo Optima has 6 gears in the transmission plus a finicky chain. To me, more gears means more places for loses due to friction. No doubt that there have been configurations that were ahead of their time, I've seen them all from hyperdrive's pinion/spur belt combo to Kyosho and Losi's externally adjustable diffs to A&L's trailing arm suspensions to Tamiya's original 3 gear transmission in the sand scorcher and related buggies. Some innovations caught on and a bunch just disappeared.

[relayer]

But you are comparing two different types of drivetrains there, plus the Optima is a terrible example of a good chain drive.

Compare the SB Sport with the SG coyote, it's the same transmission, the Coyote just loses out in the materials it uses such as a steel centre shaft instead of the newer alloy or carbon types. Losi's XXX4 is an example of a modern car with a transmission design much worse than previous single-belt cars, like the KX One, PB Mini Mustang, and the earliest of them all, Hirobo's 44b range.

[thijs]

The chassis looks like the version they've used on the latest worlds.
You can't see it very clear, but I hope It looks like it, 'cause that's a fine looking chassis.

Looks like Kyosho did A good job, I hope it's going to win some races so it puts itself in the picture. It's worth it!

[RichieRich]

But you are comparing two different types of drivetrains there, plus the Optima is a terrible example of a good chain drive.

Compare the SB Sport with the SG coyote, it's the same transmission, the Coyote just loses out in the materials it uses such as a steel centre shaft instead of the newer alloy or carbon types. Losi's XXX4 is an example of a modern car with a transmission design much worse than previous single-belt cars, like the KX One, PB Mini Mustang, and the earliest of them all, Hirobo's 44b range.

Ok, I understand you are pointing out the technical irregularities in my statement. So, let me restate it with footnotes:
In general, my point is that since 1988 when the Turbo Optima came out 1, 4WD buggies have had more efficient drive trains 2, better suspensions 3, and lighter materials 4.

1) Meaning, encompassing all 4WD buggies released since the inception of the 4WD electric buggy.

2) In this case, I am comparing the transmission of an Optima series car to an SB Sport. Technically, they do not have much in common with their drive train, though they are both 4WD electric buggies.

3) Again, comparing suspension design. Here, drive train configuration doesn't matter. Suspensions are easier to adjust, and next time you look at an Optima series car, check out the fron suspension and the cast knuckles. Note the pivot points compared to a newer buggy. Suspenion arm length has grown dramatically.

4) Finally, same comparison. Older buggies cars have less "exotic material" than the newer buggies. Carbon fiber parts, carbon composite plastics, titanium turnbuckles, machined gears, and machined aluminum. Back in the 80's no one had titanium turnbuckles. Aluminum parts were stamped. Suspension parts were "glass-filled" nylon. Very flexible.

I hope I have clarified myself properly. So, in conclusion, I can't wait to see if the Lazer ZX-5 is going to be sold in the US. I am a huge Kyosho fan and would like to see more variety in the 4WD class.

[rc411]

Forgive me for being retarded at the moment, is this a buggy to compete with Losi's 4wd xxx-4? If so... its about friggen time kyosho came back!!! Now what about the 2wd buggies, when do we see a new version that comes alive?

[tarheelquality]

I agree about the technology has come a long way, I would have liked to see kyosho do a buggy with the drive train from the kx-one and a good off road suspension. As far as 2wd from everything I have heard the last Ultima was pretty close just needed the support that other brands get and the price points.

All that being said I just hope the new Lazer makes it here, maybe they could resurrect the Optima name to import it to the states.

[relayer]

I personally think that Kyosho's Triumph could still be a race winner :eek:

I have a new one at home (I collect vintage r/c cars) and there is no reason why it wouldn't be competative today.

I hope they do release the new off roader (plus the new tourer), I would certainly get it because there needs to be more variety in the buggy classes, I think this is part of the reason Touring cars is so popular, even though most TC's perform the same, the fact that you have such a large variety competing makes this class very interesting.

[RichieRich]

relayer - I have a Triumph too. It runs very well, though the shocks are a bit soft. Probably because I used the kit oil so they need to be tuned with better stuff. What other cars do you have? You can see my buggies by clicking my homepage in my profile.

[relayer]

Richie- Yeah the shocks are the weak point of the Triumph - by that stage AE and Losi had better shocks. but you'd have to agree it's got a great gearbox. I've had all the competition cars over the years, and have built each one with the same care, and I can say that nothing compares to the speed you can pull out of the Triumph gearbox :) The only gearboxes that are close are the Cougar 2 belt drive and the Tamiya Dynastorm.

Checked you home page :cool: - I'm a member of the Tamiya club too, but I don't have my cars posted there. I don't have a lot, but what I've got is rare!

How about a brand new Hirobo Tomcat, or a Playtron Lynx 4wd, or my new work in progress, a Nikko Works Edition Brat 4wd. My favorite is my new Nichimo Luminous 4wd. I've got some pics somewhere on the net, I'll try and post a link to them :)

[relayer]

Here is the Triumph, Tomcat, and Luminous:

http://www.rc10b4.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/905/sort/1/cat/all/page/1

http://www.rc10b4.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/910/sort/1/cat/all/page/1

http://www.rc10b4.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/911/sort/1/cat/all/page/1

[Zod]

it's nice to see Kyosho making a comeback , but unfortunatly it's gonna cost too much to maintain , don`t get me wrong i want them to sell this car here , i still race MY LAZER ZX-R , and i won a couples of races with it against losi cars , to new one looks stronger , more up to date with the curent breed of 4wd cars,let`s hope they don`t mess this one up again (lazer zx-s) :)

[RichieRich]

Pretty slick Triumph, there.

[Cain]

So any more news on this one guys?

As for dropping a C-note on the SB to get it to racing specs with the Losi, I raced my SB, and didn't drop a C-Note to get it to racing specs with the Losi. $10 for wheel bearings, Cam mod so you don't need the aluminum one ( free with a dremel, or $10 for a cheap dremel ), $30 full set of B4 shocks ( KPRC I believe ).

[T/Losi]

Can't wait for that to hit the shelves and especially the track.

Cheers

[Cain]

I look forward to racing against all the various 4wd buggies that are out there now. When you have a class with alot of different chassis types you are racing with, its much more fun than say 1 type of chassis or even two.

[ChevyManDan77]

looks like something to give the xxx-4 some serious trouble

[JohnSheridan]

I do wish it was belt though, nice simple single belt would be nice, seems eveyone is going Shaft now but Losi so I guess it is a forlorn hope.

They actually did make a new 4wd BELT prototype last year but i guess it never went into production!!... I posted it here some time ago before they changed this forum im not sure if its still here..

[winning edge designs]

Beniscool6, We (J concepts) are doing another run of the BJ4 to meet the demand......So, the 4wd class will really be heating up now with the big K getting back in the mix, hopefully?

If they keep it under $500 they will do well with it loaded up as shown of course.......Jim

[xb3Guy]

um with mark pavidis going to team kyosho i hope they come back into electric off road racing and soon i hope i have the ultima st type r still race it love it hope to see more new kyosho cars and trucks

[tarvymoto]

A world title is the plan. What is the date of the next World Championchip? My quese is that Kyosho will have it out in ample time to compete.

[minijosh]

Has anyone found a place online to buy one???

[Cain]

I would suspect that if this comes to the states that tower hobbies could be a place to get it. I wonder though how much parts are going to be.

[namsjun]

I hope zx series famous once more...

[windellmc]

Kyosho is opening a US distributor. The reason that Kyosho stuff is so expensive here is because Great Plains is the only distributor. They jack up the prices. In Japan Kyosho stuff is very reasonably priced and maybe even cheap. A 777 SP1 is ~$500 in a Japanese hobby shop. With the new Kyosho distributor their prices should be competitive with everyone else.

[sugs]

Well that would be great. I've always wanted to try Kyosho stuff but the price has always sent me looking elsewhere.

[metalry101]

Come on Kyosho....I want this buggy. I've been dying to get a good 1/10 4WD off-road...but I don't want to have to mail order parts. The Academy buggy looks great...but their distribution is so limited that getting parts is mail order only for me...and I work in a hobby shop. I'll probably buy it even if it is 400 bux, as 4WD electric off-road is the greatest thing ever in my book (as evidenced by my E-Maxx, Twin Force, RC18T, RS4 MT, RS4 Rally, and Tamiya F-150) :D :D :D :D :D :D...

Go Kyosho...get this buggy out...and preferably w/ good parts availability and a reasonable price. I don't want a RTR version for myself (building a kit is the only way to go for me), but offering one at a reasonable price (even if it is an all plastic and steel "strip model" (like AE's RTR B4 and T4)) would help sales tremendously. We sell a ton of Stampedes, Rustlers, and Evaders because they're inexpensive, well made, and a helluva lotta fun. If people want 4WD they've gotta jump up to an E-maxx or one of the Tamiya buggies (that we don't really sell...and honestly...that's a good thing...they're cool...but Tamiya has too many freakin cars...so parts are a nightmare...and they don't come w/ bearings or quality electronics...and aren't really upgradable)...

Neways...the point is that Kyosho really needs to make this buggy...at least I think they do. I know I want one, and I'll buy it regardless of price, but if it's reasonably priced, I'll sell a whole lot more of them to customers.

[relayer]

With Pavidis on the team (plus another rumoured top US driver) there seems no doubt that Kyosho are planning a big comback in electric. both off road and touring cars.

The ZX5 prototype has already had success, with a couple making the A-Main at last years Japanese Nationals.

[Cain]

Will be nice to have another addition to 4wd e buggy racing. If you are looking for a class to run that isn't defaulted to just two vehicle types in the USA, this could be for you. Just need a class seperate from full out mod to make it work. Maybe 19 turn as the 4wd stocker.

[YR4Dude]

What is the latest on this car? When is it coming to the U.S. or when will it be available? I've checked the Kyosho website and there is no word about this car at all.

[Mr. Schumacher]

Don't know why Kyosho always stick with those Lazer arms... New car with old arms??? Hopefully they will put more effort on the production ones.

[TMaxxBenny25]

Can the carbon fiber chasis hold up to off road racin???

[ZeroMax]

looks like all news has disappeared, i once looked forward to getting one

[jeepinator2]

Why does Kyosho tease us so?

[microrcdude]

Can the carbon fiber chasis hold up to off road racin???
Research that.

[Windsorguy99]

Considering that this car wa based on their prototype touring car which has apparently been scrapped as Cyrul, Lemieux and the rest of the Kyosho team develop a new (reportedly) belt drive car....this off-roader may have died on the table :(

[jeepinator2]

Ah, so perhaps this is not correct:
Kyosho has released a new top-of-the-line competition off-road buggy, the ZX-5

[mgtmadness]

Carbon fiber chassis? Will that work for off-road racing? CF chassis will work fine for off-road.Yokomo used to use them all the time in the 4x4 buggies.

[kevbot]

i'm still waiting for one =|

[Cain]

So, any more news on this?

[chris1]

What is going on with the new buggy?

[Zod]

I hope that they will bring this car here with a good competitive price
were still waiting for info

[Cain]

Here is the latest 4wd from Kyosho at the '05 Japan Hobby Expo/Show

http://www.teamjoybox.com/shs05/shs05115.jpg

[kevbot]

where'd all the anodized aluminum and CF go? heh if anyone can translate that, please do =X

[chris1]

Ssssswwwweeeeettttt!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[cwginkc]

I would take the plastic tub version over the CF plate chassis anyday. Less expensive, more durable and no undertray.

[tallyrc]

where'd all the anodized aluminum and CF go? heh if anyone can translate that, please do =X
hopefully gone in order to bring us a car that we can actually afford and make feasible to bring into the US..

man that thing looks earily like the yokomo mr4-bc but shaft drive.. weird

[metalry101]

AWESOME!!!! Hopefully that will be available here...and hopefully it will be soon.

[Cain]

agreed here tallyrc. I think that is what is hurting 4wd from really exploding right now is more vehicles in a reasonable price range to go with. 4wd needs those really high end vehicles to statisfy the high dollar driver out there, but you also need the more affordable kits to bring in guys who are interested in the class but aren't hardcore racers willing to drop $500 on an electric kit when they see they can get a 1/8 scale buggy RTR for less.

I am glad MRC / Academy has the SB in 3 versions right now to satisfy the cheaper but still perform segment, but if Kyosho did release an affordable 4wd buggy to the States before the all out carbon plate edition, I know of alot of people who would jump on the 4wd bandwagon because the vehicle is kyosho.

Now if AE would only make a 4wd E buggy . . .

[YR4Dude]

I would prefer a little more alum. and CF where it is needed.

Hopefully those will be available and affordable when the kit is released. :D

[metalry101]

Totally agreed with Cain.

I'd love to pick up Academy buggy but I can't get parts for it locally. I might still pick one up anyways...but it's frustrating to not have it available through any of the big distributors. I can even get CEN stuff if I want it...but not Academy...

Pro buggies are nice...but I don't wanna drop 400 dollars on one. I can pick up a TNX for that. If I've got the choice of another nitro monster (RTR none-the-less) or an unassembled 1/10 electric buggy for the same money, I'm going to take the monster.

[chris1]

That is why 4wd buggys are almost gone is becuse of the price

[rc411]

That is why 4wd buggys are almost gone is becuse of the price

Not anymore. Kyosho basically "FIRED" GPMD as their middle man... high prices :( Kyosho America is darn near ready to take off and do their own thing. As soon as they start producting vehicles, this buggy will be in shops in no time. Cheaper parts and cars is what I predict!

Didn't you read that they raced the 2wd buggy and the 4wd at the cactus classic? What is the 2wd one called? Ultima? I am hoping that they bring back the Ultima trucks, I loved my Type R!

[chris1]

Ihope they bring back all of there buggys and trucks

[Lazerfan1]

Hey I still have my Ultima ST Type R and my Ultima RB Type R I still love them and I hope that the BIG K comes back and gives Losi and Associated a Run for their money and finally become workd champs once again it would be nice to see all of the K cars be on the front of RC Caraction as World Champs!!! Now wouldn't it????

[relayer]

There is a new version of the ZX5 on display at the Shizouka show in Japan. They have replaced all the carbon fibre parts with a moulded composite, very similar to what Losi have on their 4wd's.

As the cost of developing the moulds for these parts would be very high - can we assume that Kyosho have comitted themselves to releasing a production version?

[Lazerfan1]

I sure hope that the big K has this in mind to produce this car! If they do I wish to be the first one on the ordering list! Hopefully we shall see it on the shelves very soon!!! I can't wait till I have one and smoke some Losi and Yokomo and BJ4x4 ***! Later from Rota Spain!

[Ultima Pro XL]

In the new issue of Hi-Torques R/C Car they went ot the new Kyosho center in the US and took an unannounced tour of the place. In the article it says that Kyosho is definitely working of new 1/10 off road machines for the future. They showed them some of the stuff and they are impressed with what they saw. But can't tell the public about it now because Kyosho asked them to keep it under raps for now. I have and still race my ultima car and truck. I hope they keep that name like they have for the Lazer.

[xb3Guy]

dude loved my ultima truck wise i still had it

[Ultima Pro XL]

I still run my Ultima ST R that has every Kyosho upgrade you can get on it and I still win many races with it running in stock class. And I got a Ultima R Evolution off ebay from Japan and that car is a blast. But I'm the only person with a buggy in my area so I never get to race it. I run my Lazer ZXR when people show up with 4WD cars. none knows what kind of car it is and think it's something new!

[wcoyote_racer]

I saw a review of THe SB Pro and it said that to be truly competitive with it, you would need to change/buy a few things to bring it up to the XXX-4/Yokomo/BJ4x4's level. The SB's Graphite chassis had some flex issues, mostly due the the flex in the upper brace, and it needed to be more adjustable. So when you think about it, $340+ is probably about where the Lazer will sell. I figure that is target they need to compete with the Losi car selling wise. Sometimes you get what you pay for. I still run my YZ-10. It's highly modified, with an adjustable wheelbase done by a screw (up to 1/4" total in or out) and camber links that are mounted on top of the bulkheads instead of on the shock tower. I still kick butt with it. So I don't need a new 4WD car. Mine's already up to today's specs. :p

[dj_ski69]

Kyosho is opening a US distributor. The reason that Kyosho stuff is so expensive here is because Great Plains is the only distributor. They jack up the prices. In Japan Kyosho stuff is very reasonably priced and maybe even cheap. A 777 SP1 is ~$500 in a Japanese hobby shop. With the new Kyosho distributor their prices should be competitive with everyone else.

Dude your statement is totally wrong....
I have been living in Japan now for 6 years....
Long enough to know full well the way Japanese buisiness works and how thee economy works....
In Japan there is no bulk pricing for consumers.....There is no cheaper R/C deals on Kyosho or Tamiya either....Everything here is sold at the MSRP written on the box....Every now and then you get a "deal" with a 1000 yen ($10) discount....For example... The Ultima RB type R is still sold over here but for $400 dollars.....Actually you guys are paying less than japanese for some products ie the Super Clod Buster from Tamiya....Over here it goes for 25,000 yen...
A 777 costs $799 at the hobby shops....If you saw one for 500 then consider yourself lucky.....
The Market interest in the states is actually very high for Kyosho and Tamiya cars and trucks....The problem is that niether Kyosho or Tamiya(Tamiya actually does much better than Kyosho in USA pricing) are willing(notice how I didn't say able) to bring the price down to a State side level to compete with AE and Losi.... Not gonna happen....not now....and probably not ever untill the 2 countries economies even out some.....

You gotta understand that the Japanese way is to suck every last bit of cash out of the consumer for any given product.....Buisiness's over here compete only by having super tiny sales wars....And I mean small....But the people actually think there getting good deals....

What I said in this post is not all entirely true....some things you buy on a regular basis in japan are the same or cheaper than the equivalent product in the states.....
But in the Tech and Hobby industry....FORGET IT!!!!


Regards

SkI

[Cain]

Where did you find the review on the SB Pro? For my Pro the only thing that I added that was a must was the center battery brace which really stiffened up things on the chassis. This really improved handling. For durability I went with titanium turnbuckles but I have heard the stock units hold up pretty well.

Anyone got any more info on this Kyosho buggy? Has it been shown anywhere in the USA?

[rc411]

It was shown in rcca's july magazine, both the 4wd and the 2wd. the 2wd went nameless, i predict its an ultima ;)

[metalry101]

It was shown in rcca's july magazine, both the 4wd and the 2wd. the 2wd went nameless, i predict its an ultima ;)

Where?

[windellmc]

So here I am considering Japanese hobby shop prices and I notice that a package of 777 front suspension arms says 700 yen retail. That is about $7 in US funds. Those same arms sold for $9.99 at Tower Hobbies. Don't tell me GP was not jacking up the price.

[dj_ski69]

where are you buying from....?

[windellmc]

Kyosho prints the suggested retail on the header cards. The shop I bought from actually marked down from there but 700 was what Kyosho printed on the header.

[dj_ski69]

Even so you have to take into account that both Kyosho and/or GP have to deal with Import tax and shipping costs from Japan....Kyosho products are made in Japan....therefore On some products that you might see a bit higher cost in the states is mainly due to this....Do you really expect GP to sell without a profit margin? Sure it would be nice, but then again GP probably would not have been around this long if they did....Others products from Kyosho ie The Magnetic Mayhem Motors...Are made solely for Export from Japan into The US and other participating countries....You cannot buy Magnetic Mayhem Motors here in Japan....You can't even order them unless you are getting then from the States.....
unless Kyosho starts producing items in the states, you will not see pricing to your liking on most of thiere stuff....

[windellmc]

Actually I think 777 arms are the same or cheaper than Losi XXXnt truck arms. So a US made product actually costs more. 3 years ago Kyosho parts were high here, but the price has stayed the same since then (and even gone done now that Kyosho America is open) and everyone else has gone up so they are actually about average now. BTW a lot of those Kyosho parts are made in Taiwan by the same company that makes the Hyper 7.

[Bart_Banaan]

^^^KICK ^^

There are some beautiful detailled photo's published of the car of Marc Pavidis' Kyosho at the Offroad Warmup 2005 in Italy last weekend (11.june 2005):

http://homepage3.nifty.com/ksrclifestyle/kyoshoproto.htm


http://homepage3.nifty.com/ksrclifestyle/zx50211.jpg

[relayer]

It was a good result for Pavidas - making the A Main at the worlds warm up.

Have a look at those pictures - the car looks very much finished to me, perhaps just a few adjustments to the type of composite material used for the chassis.

Overall, the car looks very good, bring on the worlds :D

[adam lancia]

that's great news for kyosho....pavidis strong in the main and the car looks very polished. now, if they can price it competitively they'll have a very successful car,

adam

[munim]

Any new info on this?

[relayer]

Any new info on this?

The car will be out before the end of the year. At the recent worlds, the Kyosho drivers ran basically full production spec cars - with Pavidis commenting that just one or two parts need a re-design before the car is ready. :D

[winning edge designs]

From what people have said about the new Kyosho cars, they looked very good at the worlds and so did Mark for someone who has spent most of his time lately helping to develop new cars........Testing and racing at the same time is tuff..............Jim

[relayer]

From what people have said about the new Kyosho cars, they looked very good at the worlds and so did Mark for someone who has spent most of his time lately helping to develop new cars........Testing and racing at the same time is tuff..............Jim

Exactly :D

Pavidis had two times good enough for the A-Main, he just needed one more good run in the last round. Unfortunately the car broke (hence his comments about a couple of parts needing to be fixed), so he missed out.

But considering both he and Jeremy Kortz haven't done much electric racing this year - they did a great job. Jeremy even had the new 2wd in 5th spot after the first round :eek:

[munim]

There's a new 2wd as well?

[relayer]

There's a new 2wd as well?

Yep :D

It was running very well at the worlds too!

It will be a while before the 2wd is out though, they are still testing quite a few different suspension and bulkhead configurations.

[NiMo]

http://www.kyosho.co.jp/web/products/car_bike/buggy/ep4wdracing/laser_zx5/laser_zx5-j.html

More info, September release?

[Freem]

Good Find NiMo!!!

I am really excited about this car and Kyosho's return to electric kits in general. My first car was a Kyosho Ultima in the late 80's. I have been wanting Kyosho to make a 4wd car years. Kyosho makes excellent cars and this car may usher in a new golden era of RC!!!! ;)

Freem

[relayer]

http://www.kyosho.co.jp/web/products/car_bike/buggy/ep4wdracing/laser_zx5/laser_zx5-j.html

More info, September release?

Sounds like the car includes diff/one-way/spool options for the front standard.

But it also sounds like dogbones only in the rear :(

Retail price listed as approx $385 USD. Actual street price may be quite a bit cheaper.

[Tamiya4ever]

Will there be a US release? Or just in Japan.

[ChumsGum]

Amazing!
http://www.kyosho.co.jp/web/products/car_bike/buggy/ep4wdracing/laser_zx5/img/001.jpg

[StevePond]

It will be released in the US.

[Windsorguy99]

lol@ Steve...

there's going to be a lot of cynicism to overcome as Kyosho seemed to walk away from the US market for a bit....but anyone that doubts Kyosho's renewed focus on the US market needs to take a LONG HARD look at what they've done over the past year...adding drivers like Cyrul, Pavidis and Lemieux (some were Kyosho before..but now are FULL LINE Kyosho) and hiring industry insiders like StevePond and Joel Johnson for the newly born Kyosho USA (my apologies if I have the official name incorrect)...

[StevePond]

:) It's Kyosho America, but close enough. I understand the appearances and that's a perception that we have to fight to correct. Kyosho never walked away from the US market - in fact it's quite the opposite. I'll be the first to agree that there was a long down period during the transition to Kyosho America, but the US market has been a priority of Kyosho for decades. In my position with the magazine I spent many years in conversation with Kyosho and I KNOW that the whole team is here to make it much better than it's ever been. That's why I made the decision to come on board. I think Kyosho's relation with the US market has already improved over where it's been for the last few years, but I know there's still much more room for improvement. W99, we're focusing intensely on the job at hand, and hope to show regular, steady improvement as we move forward. Thanks for noticing. ;)

As for the ZX-5, it's something that I've been personally interested in seeing brought back to the US and we lobbied hard to get as many cars as we could for the US. I think we have the largest share of production anywhere in the world. The initial release is going to be limited quantities, and we wanted as many as we could get. The cars are coming soon and so are the parts.

[metalry101]

:) It's Kyosho America, but close enough. I understand the appearances and that's a perception that we have to fight to correct. Kyosho never walked away from the US market - in fact it's quite the opposite. I'll be the first to agree that there was a long down period during the transition to Kyosho America, but the US market has been a priority of Kyosho for decades. In my position with the magazine I spent many years in conversation with Kyosho and I KNOW that the whole team is here to make it much better than it's ever been. That's why I made the decision to come on board. I think Kyosho's relation with the US market has already improved over where it's been for the last few years, but I know there's still much more room for improvement. W99, we're focusing intensely on the job at hand, and hope to show regular, steady improvement as we move forward. Thanks for noticing. ;)

As for the ZX-5, it's something that I've been personally interested in seeing brought back to the US and we lobbied hard to get as many cars as we could for the US. I think we have the largest share of production anywhere in the world. The initial release is going to be limited quantities, and we wanted as many as we could get. The cars are coming soon and so are the parts.
Good to hear from you Steve! I'm excited to see all of the cool new things Kyosho is bringing to our shores. :) I think I'm going to have to buy both Blizzards, a Twin Force, the Lazer that this thread is about, and maybe one of those 1/10 4WD nitro stadium trucks. Maybe you could convince Kyosho to come out with a truck version of the Lazer, or convert the 1/10 4WD nitro stadium (Inferno ST I think it is?) into an electric? I've already got an RS4 MT, love it to death, and I'd love to see something else like it...but maybe shaft driven. Anyways...I have faith in Kyosho. My boss (the LHS owner) told me that Kyosho recently dropped their minimum order requirement that they previously had in place, which tells me Kyosho is really making progress towards being fully operational in the U.S. The minimum order thing was going to kill smaller shops (unless they got stuff through HRP...which let's be honest...isn't that many shops...), but by dropping that, shops will now be able to get parts for people without being force to go through HRP (nothing wrong with HRP, but signing up for another distributor just to get one company that you can't otherwise get is a PITA), or wait for a ridiculous quantity of stuff, or having to order a kit or 3 with each parts order. Very, very smart move on Kyosho's part there! Anyways...I'm glad to hear from ya Steve...and I'm glad to hear that things at Kyosho America are going well!

[StevePond]

Thanks M101! I'm excited too! I think you're going to need a bigger workshop. :p As for the minimum order, it's pretty much standard operating procedure for most distributors and that's why we started with a minimum order, but the consensus of team was that it hurt the smaller shops, so out it went. It was only for the first order BTW, but still an obstacle for some shops and we didn't want that. Many shops have since shared the same opinion and are happy that it's been removed. It's nice to know you're behind us - thanks for the support.

[Windsorguy99]

Sounds like Kyosho America is just wrestling with some of the minor hurdles that plagued RCAmerica when it started up last year...except I'm glad to hear it doesn't sound like Kyosho's orders were held hostage in customs for 2 months :o

I'm glad to hear things are going smoothly though...a healthy Kyosho in North America is good for the industry...

I wasn't trying to imply that Kyosho walked away from North America by splitting with GP.....I see that as a major step in coming back...I was referring to the years where prices were high, availability was poor and product ranges were limited....only GP and Kyosho know who did what...

When I started in RC it was Joel vs Jay, Kyosho vs AE....there was no Losi yet....when I got back in a few years ago I was shocked to see Kyosho's presence (in my area) reduced to a couple 1/8 buggies and Mini-Z's....

Best of luck to Kyosho...I'm a devout fan of Xray...but their product line is still growing...in the meantime Kyosho may be just the ticket to fill in the gaps ;)

[Laterilus]

great news about Kyosho America, Steve. However, for me and the other racers watching this thread, it really comes down to the end result. When is this great looking 4WD buggy getting released? I know it is probably being kept hush hush and all, but you could throw out a particular month it will be ready or possibly tell us that it will be ready for indoor winter racing this year? Can't you? :) I really like the design of this buggy. I've been looking at the others that are made in a similar way, but the MRC I hear has very weak parts and who knows when the BJ4 people are ever going to make more kits (besides, I really hate that 450$ price tag). With Kyosho's previously released quality kits over the years, I'd assume nothing less with this new buggy. Plus, I figure the kit at least won't be as expensive as the BJ4.

[ChumsGum]

I've been a long time Kyosho fan and have bought my cars and parts through Tower Hobbies. What does this new Kyosho America mean to me? Will Kyosho and Tower still have a relationship? Will I see Kyosho cars at Hobby People (not just Mini-Zs and the Inferno)?

[windellmc]

Here you go. It will be on sale September 30 in Japan.

http://www.kyosho.co.jp/web/products/car_bike/buggy/ep4wdracing/laser_zx5/laser_zx5-j.html

[StevePond]

When is this great looking 4WD buggy getting released?

The initial shipment of ZX-5s are coming to the states via air shipment, and at no extra cost to the dealer. We simply want our customers to have them as quickly as any other country. So, once they are released, they'll be put on a plane and as soon as they're through customs, they'll be on their way to dealers. The release is currently scheduled for late Sep. to early Oct.

[metalry101]

SWEEEEEET! I won't have money by then...but that's sweet anyways!

[StevePond]

See my post right up there... ^^^^^^ :D

[Laterilus]

Thanks for the update Steve! I'm assuming hobby shops will be able to pre-order them soon since the release date is so close? I know you mentioned that only a limited amount will be coming over with the initial shippment, but I want to make sure I have one in that first batch! Who should the hobby shops contact? I'm not sure about the whole ordering process that hobby shops must go through. Do they contact Kyosho America directly now since there is no more distributor?

[Laterilus]

Oh, any word on pricing? Also, is Kyosho releasing their own wheels? What other manufacturer's wheels will fit if I can't find any Kyosho wheels? Lastly, will a set of wheels and tires be packed into the kit?

[StevePond]

Laterilus - We just added the information to our system and sent pricing information to dealers yesterday, so they are now able to pre-order the ZX-5 if they wish. The final selling price will be up to the hobby store of course, but they should average somewhere in the low 300 range. Wheels and body are included but not tires.

[metalry101]

Who should the hobby shops contact? I'm not sure about the whole ordering process that hobby shops must go through. Do they contact Kyosho America directly now since there is no more distributor?
They can either order directly from Kyosho, or from HRP, or even from both. HRP is more convienient for my LHS for most things since we don't have to pay shipping. They're located about 15 minutes away :D. Kyosho would probably be the quicker way to go since they get their stuff direct...whereas HRP has to get it from Kyosho and then ship it out...but then again, saving money on combined shipping with other stuff from HRP might make those extra few days worth the wait for most shops. I believe HRP will be stocking most everything Kyosho...

[Tamiya4ever]

Laterilus - We just added the information to our system and sent pricing information to dealers yesterday, so they are now able to pre-order the ZX-5 if they wish. The final selling price will be up to the hobby store of course, but they should average somewhere in the low 300 range. Wheels and body are included but not tires.

Do you work for Kyosho? Just wondering. And what on-line hobbyshops will order them because my local one don't carry Kyosho at all.

[Freem]

Steve

Thanks for keeping us up to date! There is a lot of interest in this car and kyosho's return to electronic off road in general. With the release of this kit and future products Kyosho may get ahead of the market. If this happens please stay the course, Kyosho has a strong and loyal fan base! ;) A couple of post up someone mention developing a 4wd stadium truck. I think that is a great idea and I hope Kyosho takes it on board. I think there is an unspoken market for a 4wd stadium truck, even if it is just in stock form.

[hardadz]

Just to let people know who are looking for a place to buy(in this case even pre-order) a Kyosho Lazer ZX-5 goto www.evolutionhobbies.com and hit the "my store" button to enter there online store .They have them listed and from what i hear there even taking pre-order's/prepay.Kyosho site say's early october release!! looks like kyosho has some hot products coming out .Move over Losi there a new man in town for the 4wd class!!
Again www.evolutionhobbies.com .

[Laterilus]

Already have mine ordered and paid for. :D Let's just hope Kyosho can still release them by the first week of October. Sure would be nice to get mine before the ROAR region 8 electric off-road regionals the weekend of October 6th....Either way, I can't wait to get my new Lazer!

[cwginkc]

Already have mine ordered and paid for. :D Let's just hope Kyosho can still release them by the first week of October. Sure would be nice to get mine before the ROAR region 8 electric off-road regionals the weekend of October 6th....Either way, I can't wait to get my new Lazer!
Laterilus,

Hope you get your ZX5 before the region 8 race so I can check it out. Do you race at Chili often?

Chris

[Laterilus]

Actually, I never have. I used to live in Columbia when I went to college, but never got a chance to run up at Chilli. I now live in St. Louis and run mainly at DB. In the winter, I'll run at Troy, Marion, Hallsville, etc...I'm much more into gas racing with electric being secondary. It was just something to do in the winter, but I wanted to get more into it this winter. Figured the regional would be a perfect race to start off the winter season. It would be nice if all the preorders were filled out prior to the race. I probably would have to bring my painting supplies though. I doubt I would have time to paint up the body before I left for Chilli. Either way, if I have the box in hand, I'll be bringing it with me and putting it together in my hotel room!

[Freem]

Lat

Where did you order your Lazer? And if don't mind me asking how much did it cost?

thanks

[Laterilus]

www.evolutionhobbies.com. They only had 4 coming to them, and last time I checked, there were only 2 left. The kit is 330$. Very reasonable when compared to the losi XXX4 or the extremely expensive BJ4. I should be getting a parts list this week so that I can order plenty of spares.

Steve, just curious, what materials will the chassis and upper deck be made of when the kit is released? Pictures of Mark Pavidas' car from the worlds show woven carbon graphite plates for the upper deck and main chassis, but the pictures from the Kyosho Japanese sites show plastic or carbon composite pieces.

[JbC5]

So when and where can I order the new Lazer from? I'd like one too!!

[relayer]

Steve, just curious, what materials will the chassis and upper deck be made of when the kit is released? Pictures of Mark Pavidas' car from the worlds show woven carbon graphite plates for the upper deck and main chassis, but the pictures from the Kyosho Japanese sites show plastic or carbon composite pieces.

Actually, Marks car at the worlds used a production chassis and top deck, which is the composite plastic you're referring to.

[metalry101]

Do you work for Kyosho? Just wondering. And what on-line hobbyshops will order them because my local one don't carry Kyosho at all.
Yes, Steve does now work for Kyosho.

[Keyz]

Steve,
If the wheels for the new buggys have metric wheel mounting, will you guys be considering making adaptors to fit other style wheels? The american companies are coming closer and closer with their wheel mounting styles (ae can use losi rears and vice versa, BJ4/yokomo prototypes can use same wheels as losi too..)

I can't see it would be that dificult to do, and could lead to an easier cross over from american cars to the new metric car for many of your future customers (no need to buy newwheels and tyres, just bolt em on...)

Your thoughts?

[relayer]

Steve,
If the wheels for the new buggys have metric wheel mounting, will you guys be considering making adaptors to fit other style wheels? The american companies are coming closer and closer with their wheel mounting styles (ae can use losi rears and vice versa, BJ4/yokomo prototypes can use same wheels as losi too..)

I can't see it would be that dificult to do, and could lead to an easier cross over from american cars to the new metric car for many of your future customers (no need to buy newwheels and tyres, just bolt em on...)

Your thoughts?

Good Idea! But unfortunately it's not that simple.

As well as the different wheel mounting system, there is obviously also a difference in axle size, as the Kyosho uses metric axles, wheelnuts etc. From memory you would need to slightly ream out Losi or AE rims to fit them on the 5mm Kyosho axle - which you don't want to do if you're also using those rims on your 2wd.

Then there is the offset issue - it's unlikely that the offset between the Kyosho rims and Losi rims would be the same (I can almost gaurantee it isn't) - so you will be changing the cars width :(

[StevePond]

I'm a huge advocate of standardization, so I would prefer that all cars have as many universal components as possible. Touring cars are a good example of a standard that evolved all on its own, and all manufacturers, except Losi initially, went with a 12mm hub. Unfortunately, no standard ever evolved in the 4WD electric class, so each buggy has a different wheel mount. It's certainly worth exploring as many options as possible, so we'll take a look at the mount and see if there's a workable solution to adapt other popular wheels in the US.

[hardadz]

I have a parts list for the new Lazer ZX5 if interested. It just came today and if you give me an email address i will send it to you. Kyosho has not listed parts prices yet so they are not included. email me at hardadz@yahoo.com

[Archyman]

Not sure why I'm not able to get into that site to order one...I was going to try and get the Predator X10 but havent heard anything send several e-mail tried to reserve one and no responses...not very good customer support to me.....so kindof make me a bit leary of them....so maybe I'll look at the kyosho if I can ever get into the site....

[hardadz]

Not sure why I'm not able to get into that site to order one...I was going to try and get the Predator X10 but havent heard anything send several e-mail tried to reserve one and no responses...not very good customer support to me.....so kindof make me a bit leary of them....so maybe I'll look at the kyosho if I can ever get into the site....

what site are you going to for the Kyosho?

[Archyman]

trying that evolutionhobbies site

[hardadz]

trying that evolutionhobbies site When you go to the Store make sure to click yes on the security warning. Also I just tried the TT site and had no problem getting in www.ttechracing.com The other site is www.evolutionhobbies.com and if you need a parts list email them.

[Archyman]

When you go to the Store make sure to click yes on the security warning. Also I just tried the TT site and had no problem getting in www.ttechracing.com The other site is www.evolutionhobbies.com and if you need a parts list email them.
Ya please send me a parts list....copn1822@aol.com...Thanks, George

[hardadz]

Ya please send me a parts list....copn1822@aol.com...Thanks, George

By the time you read this it should be in your inbox.

[Archyman]

I've been trying to get ahold of ttech for the past few months and never a response....so I think I'm not wasting anymore time on eather....thanks for all the help though...

[Keyz]

Hi Relayer, and thanks for answering steve...
I understand the difficulties with adapting the wheels, but essentially that is what adaptors would take into account.

I understand the offsets would be different for the wheels, so there would also need to be consideration given to suspension arm lengths, hub widths from pivot to wheel mounting position etc. However as the kyosho cars appear narrower than the american counterparts (the 12mm hubs for the kyoshos are on front and rear of both the ZX-5 and 2wd proto and maybe 5mm deep or more, to which the amarican cars have far slimmer mounting hubs e.g. losi rears are a piece of wire, fronts are maybe 2mm piece of alloy) then there is room to remove the metric adapter and have a further adaptor that spaces the wheels out far enough to equal the width of the metric setup, and therefore the handling characteristics would be the same as the wheels would be in the same place as designed by Kyosho in the first place.

The idea just occured to me after seeing the 2wd prototype with essentially a losi front wheel mounting system with a 12mm adaptor to fit new style front wheels. If you are working American hub carriers to fit metric wheels, then surely there will be a possibility of backward engineering that so the reverse is true (standard wheels on metric car).

I would let the engineers do their work in this regard as it may be a closer run thing, but it was just an idea.

Obvoiusly I race Losi, but AE 2wd seems to have different front mounting at the moment too (worlds cars with screws going into hubs maybe..)??

Cheers :D

[JbC5]

So, is that a decent car or is it junk? It looks like any number of shaft-driven contenders out there...

In the old days, if it wasn't Losi, RC-10, Shcumacher Cat, Yokomo YZ-10 (88-93)... it simply wasn't competative.

Is this the real deal from Tamaiya? Will it compete with the new Lazer? Any thoughts?

[YoKoMo-MX4]

So, is that a decent car or is it junk? It looks like any number of shaft-driven contenders out there...

In the old days, if it wasn't Losi, RC-10, Shcumacher Cat, Yokomo YZ-10 (88-93)... it simply wasn't competative.

Is this the real deal from Tamaiya? Will it compete with the new Lazer? Any thoughts?Umm, I think you are in the wrong thread. This is supposed to be the Lazer ZX-5 thread... Although I noticed the last few posts have been off topic ... :)

If you want info on the SB Sport, check out this thread (http://www.rc10b4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2601) (250+ pages) on RC10B4.com. One other thing, the SB Sport is not by Tamiya (based in Japan) it is made by Academy Model Co. based in (South?) Korea and imported to the USA by Model Rectifier Corp (http://modelrec.com).

'nuff said,
MX4

[JbC5]

Umm, I think you are in the wrong thread. This is supposed to be the Lazer ZX-5 thread... Although I noticed the last few posts have been off topic ... :)

If you want info on the SB Sport, check out .....

Thanks for clarifying the relationship between MRC, Academy, and Tamaiya.

However, I was more curious about it from a competition standpoint for the Lazer- is it the real deal- will it compete with the LAZER or is it a trashy knock-off?

Lots of choices... how will effect sales of the new Lazer... Kyosho is getting back into the 4WD electric kinda late to the party.

[deedlit]

My local hobby store is saying october and like 350 ish on price ..

[hardadz]

parts price list is available, email or PM me with an email address to send to

[dj_ski69]

My big question is this:
Is the Spur Gear gonna be compatible to any current RR, Kimbrough, Losi, AE etc...type spur gears...?
Or are we gonna be stuck with a proprietary design that will be a pain in the but to aquire differnet sizes...?

Also the closest thing AE has come to a 4WD Buggy is The Durango....
Check it out HERE (http://www.rc10.de/)

[hardadz]

Heres what i just received from Kyosho America:

length:380mm(14.96")
width:248mm(9.76")
height:145mm(5.71")
wheelbase:270mm(10.63")
track, front:210mm(8.27") rear:200mm(7.87")
ground clearance:24mm(0.94:)
gear ratio:11.47:1
weight, approx:1650g(58.2oz)

needed for operation:

2 channel radio, ESC, 1700-3800 NiMH batteries, electric motor
At this time i understand that the following apply:
front hubs are 7 degree
front diff
carbon composite arms
aluminum center sgaft
threaded aluminum shocks
sway bar
CVD's & dog bones

all items are subject to engineering changes

[hardadz]

seems i cannot post pics so please email or PM me for them I have 9 pics total

[Gojira]

My big question is this:
Is the Spur Gear gonna be compatible to any current RR, Kimbrough, Losi, AE etc...type spur gears...?
Or are we gonna be stuck with a proprietary design that will be a pain in the but to aquire differnet sizes...?

Also the closest thing AE has come to a 4WD Buggy is The Durango....
Check it out HERE (http://www.rc10.de/)
thats not true the jconcepts bj4x4 is AE based and so is the 0 conversion

[hardadz]

I have a PDF file for those interested. Please email or PM me with your email addy.

[StevePond]

My big question is this:
Is the Spur Gear gonna be compatible to any current RR, Kimbrough, Losi, AE etc...type spur gears...?

Attached is an exploded view of the slipper, which shows how diffficult it would be to make the slipper compatible with a common pan car spur gear. The world of electric racing cars deviated from a stadard of any sort a long time ago, however. The Losi car uses a unique spur gear, as does the Yokomo and the Schumacher. I personally would like to see all the cars use a standard gear configuration, but even the belt-drive cars (which are the easiest to adapt) have unique spur gears.

[Keyz]

Steve,
Is there any possibility of a dirt guard or something for the spur/pinion gear?

I race on loose tracks, and that puppy looks like it's just gonnna suck stones in!

[Windsorguy99]

Steve,

is the same slipper design/spur used on the new 2WD car?

[Laterilus]

Steve, is everything on schedule for the Lazer to be released to the public either this week or next week?

[StevePond]

Keys, I'm not sure, but I'll check into it.

Windosorguy99 - I haven't had a look under the body of the 2WD car to see what they're using for a slipper. It's so early in the develpment stages that it would be premature to say what the final version will include, but I'll see if I can find out more here as well.

Laterilus - so far everything is on schedule and they should be released shortly.

[StevePond]

Just an update - we expect delivery of a limited quantity of ZX-5 buggies this week. If your hobby shop doesn't already have it on order, there's not much chance of getting one of the first shipment - there's a sliver of a chance, but I wouldn't wait ;). We already have a comprehensive stock of replacement parts.

[Archyman]

Steve What shop are you with

[hardadz]

This week? Have Tim call me if this is so, he did'nt say a word when I talked to him Friday.

[StevePond]

He didn't know when you talked to him on Friday ;) I just learned this morning that we'd get a limited shipment. Archyman, I'm with Kyosho America.

[TRF-Inferno]

For those who were wondering about the bottom of the chassis, here's a pic: (Courtesy of kenonrc.com)

http://www.rckenon.com/public_html/shop2/catalog/images/30076%20Lazer%20ZX-5%20Chassis-5.jpg

I'm a Kyosho nut as well, so I'm sure this buggy will end up in my possession sooner or later. :)

[JasonD]

Any word about the new Kyosho 2WD?

Thanks.

J

[StevePond]

Jason, the 2WD car is just a prototype. It ran nicely at the Worlds and there's a lot of optimism that it could be a very competitve machine, but there's no indication as to if and when it might go into production. It'll be a while at best.

[oOple]

For those who were wondering about the bottom of the chassis, here's a pic: (Courtesy of kenonrc.com)

http://www.rckenon.com/public_html/shop2/catalog/images/30076%20Lazer%20ZX-5%20Chassis-5.jpg

I'm a Kyosho nut as well, so I'm sure this buggy will end up in my possession sooner or later. :)



thats a photo from kyosho, not kenon rc... not sure why "kenon" feel the need to protect it as their own photo when its not even theirs ? odd.

anyway you can see a bigger version on this thread without kenons garbage all over it:
http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18867&page=1&pp=15

[Windsorguy99]

Probably for the same reason RCCA will watermark pics....they are hosting the picture and if someone is going to leech pics from them and use their badwidth, they want to label the pics....

I actually asked Steve about it on one of the Xray threads where I noticed this while he was still with RCCA....

[oOple]

rcca have not watermarked the few pics ive just looked at, and after all, its not their photo..
a watermark in the corner yea, but this has obviously been done so people cant take it and use it, even tho its a photo kenon have downloaded from another site themselves. Odd behaviour!


if you want some chassis shots i will take some tonight, my ZX5 was supposed to be here by monday but finally i got it today.

[dj_ski69]

FYI the ZX-5 is available for sale here in Japan as of Oct 1....
But...
Consider yourselves lucky the price tag in the states is much better...
The cost for the Kit here is $420.00
So much for thinking things are cheaper in Japan for japanese made products...I'm a bit perplexed by this but oh well...

SkI

[Freem]

Ski

Do you have any indication of how sales are doing so far? I will be in Japan in December, I was thinking about getting the kit then. Ski if you decided to buy the kit please keep us informed.

[Gojira]

in japan when it says msrp thats what you pay,like if you look at tamiyas website and the model your lookin at says 777$ thats what it cost in japan but to buy that model here it is only like 450-500$

[Cain]

The unique spur gear looks similar to how the Academy SB has its spur gear with the notches. I wonder if there may be some compatibility there?

[Laterilus]

Oople, are you a sponsored driver? Is that why you are getting your buggy so quickly? I know I'm sounding like a broken record here, but does Kyosho have an actual date set in place now when they'll be sending the buggy out to shops? I get impatient... I just can't wait!

[StevePond]

The first shipment of ZX-5s should be in the warehouse today or tomorrow and will starting shipping to US hobbyshops by tomorrow or Monday at the latest.

[oOple]

Ive stuck a few photos up as im goin thru the build.

http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/lazer01.jpg


www.oople.com (http://www.oople.com) - follow the trail

btw it came out last wednesday i think 28th sept

[TimJohnson]

These are shipping out in the morning :) Right Steve?

[StevePond]

Yep.

[Wonderflupke]

http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/lazer03.jpg
http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/lazer05.jpg
http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/lazer02.jpg
http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/lazer06.jpg
http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/lazer04.jpg
http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/lazer07.jpg

[TRF-Inferno]

Quit tempting my credit card! :p

[ffactory666]

Hi Wonderfluke and Oople.
Could one of you guys measure were the batteries sit and give me a measurement of the longest battery that will fit in there.Obviously 6 cells fit but is there a little bit more room left for and aft.

I run Lipos so i want to know if my current packs will fit .

[TimJohnson]

Quit tempting my credit card! :p
*ZX-5 voice from a distance* Buuuuuyyyyy mee............you can win lots of races......buuuyyyy meeee....

LOL

[oOple]

Hi Wonderfluke and Oople.
Could one of you guys measure were the batteries sit and give me a measurement of the longest battery that will fit in there.Obviously 6 cells fit but is there a little bit more room left for and aft.

I run Lipos so i want to know if my current packs will fit .


i cant tell you the measurements off the top of my head, but as my review (not finished) states the cells CAN be moved fore and aft in the slots- the slots are oversized to allow this, and the battery strap can be turned 180 degrees to secure the cells at the front or rear of the battery tray

[TimJohnson]

If time allows me, I may be able to get that mesurement for you on monday.

[StevePond]

Hi Wonderfluke and Oople.
Could one of you guys measure were the batteries sit and give me a measurement of the longest battery that will fit in there.Obviously 6 cells fit but is there a little bit more room left for and aft.

I run Lipos so i want to know if my current packs will fit .

143mm is about the maximum length between the posts that hold the battery strap in place. If you removed the front post for the battery hold-down and secured the pack by another means, you could push it to about 156mm. Anything more that the aforementioned and you'd be cramming the pack into place. Hope that helps.

[oOple]

Full review, comparison, and test drive up now.


http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/zx5/


it isnt up to RCCA standards so forgive my spelling and editorial style.

[chris1]

That one good review.

[ffactory666]

143mm is about the maximum length between the posts that hold the battery strap in place. If you removed the front post for the battery hold-down and secured the pack by another means, you could push it to about 156mm. Anything more that the aforementioned and you'd be cramming the pack into place. Hope that helps.


Sweet Steve , i'm at 137mm with my lipo pack.

[ffactory666]

Awsome review Oople and cool website you have.

You sold me on the ZX5 , better get my order in.

[TRF-Inferno]

Awsome review Oople and cool website you have.

You sold me on the ZX5 , better get my order in.
I second that. Nice review, will get mine here in a few weeks.

[Laterilus]

Should be getting mine later on this week. Great review oople. I can't wait to wheelin' my own. :)

[oOple]

Cheers everyone for the positive comments

just was looking at the lap times from yesterday and i was consistently 1 second a lap slower than the winner, i would be going very well to be that close with my BJ4 which is dialed, what can i say hes a better driver than me. And that from a car that still had room to improve setup-wise..



Steve, can you PM or mail me, as your pm is disabled ? wanted to ask you something.

[Keyz]

oOple;
Your website and collection are wicked, I have been a big fan for some time now. With the reviews and things, plus extra's you are starting to produce, it is becoming a great resource, plus all the exclusives you get are great (Cat prototype etc)

Was just wondering if you got much dirt in the spur/pinion mesh while you were testing. I asked Steve earlier if they were going to make a cover, as I race on loose dirt (not blue groove or grass) so this could be a real issue. The more I thought about the guard, the more it seemed not possible due to the top deck etc.

However I wondered what about an undertray like the earlier lazers? That would probably solve the problem for me, only issue then being cooling.

You could even have small screws tapped into the sidewalls of the chassis to hold it in place, nothing to catch on the surface..

Thoughts oOple/Steve/others?

[oOple]

Hi mate,
Thanks for your kind comments, I'm slowly making it better, hope to have some more reviews on there (other cars etc) in a while and update that lazer review with the Ti Screws, carbon fibre chassis parts and others.

Yea i dont see a way to totally seal the drivetrain like you mention, but to be honest i think it would be ok..
the hole is there to let dirt out and the shell / chassis seem to be fairly well sealed, tho if you start putting holes in the shell for cooling that might not apply..
I've not run the ZX5 on dirt (apart from the photos) but i did run the bj4 at tiverton this year, which had plenty of dust and loose stuff, and there didnt seem to be a problem, i wouldnt worry about it too much to be honest.

[Wonderflupke]

Here is the video :
http://www.kyosho.co.jp/web/download/movie/2005prshow/wm/lazer_zx-5.wmv

[YR4Dude]

Nice video! Now if only the tracks here in the U.S. were as nice as the one in the video. Hmmmmm... Anyone got some pics of this going over some doubles?? Triples?? Tabletops???

[chris1]

sweet video now I want one but there is no one racing 4wd in ohio.

[YR4Dude]

I was looking through the parts listings at SpeedtechRC and I noticed that some of the parts looked familiar, hubs, hub carriers, steering knuckles. Just wondering are those carried over from the TF series parts bin?

Also the suspension arms look new in design, are they backward compatible with the older Lazer buggies?

[xb3Guy]

Just got a question anybody no of is kyosho working or planning a truck anytime soon

[TRF-Inferno]

Just got a question anybody no of is kyosho working or planning a truck anytime soon
There are words of a 2WD EP 1/10th scale buggy in the works, and if Kyosho follows the same line such as they did with the Outrage, there is a good chance that a stadium truck may spawn from the buggy.

[Kyosho Fan]

I only wish Kysoho would move up on their prices for spare parts as well. The new cars are really looking awesome, but buying goes fast, spare parts prices used be quite a pain in the past where I live. Instead of a truck, I hope Kyosho brings the ZX-5 "carbon pro version" fast...although a 2WD buggy could be tempting as well.... :D

[Wonderflupke]

It is so pretty!!! I want one.

[Key]

Carbon or no carbon it looks much much better than those mutant looking 4WD electric buggies currently out there. Especially when compared to ALLSTARS of the past like Tamiya Avantes and Egresses, Kyosho Optima Mids, Marui Samurais, Schumacher Cats, etc..

Besides the associated higher costs of 4WD LOOKS play a part with ones' purchasing decision.

[RCSavage]

Where we run we convert the carbon chassis back to plastic because the traction is low and the plastic flexs and gives more traction.

[oOple]

the car already has a carbon chassis.

[Key]

oOple I would like to commend you on your very informative website and on the outstanding effort and incomparable A+ review of the ZX-5. Excellent work :)

With your experience would you recommend replacing the rear dogbones the kit comes standard with and switch to universals (rear)?

[kensung]

OOPLE, thanks for having this excellent review, after reading the review, i decide to buy this kit, which i already order it from my local hobby shop and it will probably arrive next week. But due to i m a definite newbie for 1/10 electric buggy class. i need yr expert advice on tire choice. Any recommendation? on rear and front tire. Pls help.

thanks

kenneth

[oOple]

Thanks both of you for the kind comments, it was hard work in such a short space of time to get it done with photos and test race, paint wasnt even dry when it went for the test race !

Key:, the dogbones perform fine, its just that in the event of a crash / broken rear end you could loose one.. if you build it right they shouldnt "pop out" in normal racing.

Kensung: Tyres im afraid i cant really help, it depends what surfaces youll be running on and im sure for dirt type tracks the US boys will know far more than me. I run schumacher mini spikes in yellow compound. for surfaces like grass and other non-dirt surfaces they work really well..
For dirt, proline and losi make the best tyres, but again im not sure which ones, and i think they have only a limited range of front 4wd tyres.

Cheers
jimmy

[YR4Dude]

the car already has a carbon chassis.


Really??? I thought the stock chassis from the box is just plain old ABS plastic. If anyone can clarify this I would appreciate it. Steve?? Anyone from Kyosho? :confused:

Also, I just started putting mine together and I absolutely love the included front diff options available in the kit without have to purchase it as an upgrade (talk about value!!)

Has anyone tried using the spool for a front end with the oneway on the shaft? What about running both the shaft and diff oneway together? I would appreciate any comments on the effects of the various drive options. :)

[relayer]

What's the cheapest price for this car so far??

I would like to get one but have to sell the old ZXR LAzer first ;)

[oOple]

there is no difference when running shaft and front one ways, the front one way over rides any effect of the shaft. but its not possible with the kit since it comes with 2 one way bearings, if you want to run the centre one way you have to use a bearing from the front one way... you can only run one or the other, which isnt a problem like i said as they dont effect each other in any way.


i already confirmed it has a carbon chassis, i guess since you dont beleive me you could do what i did a stick a pack of cells against it, or even easier read the box ! :D

[YR4Dude]

there is no difference when running shaft and front one ways, the front one way over rides any effect of the shaft. but its not possible with the kit since it comes with 2 one way bearings, if you want to run the centre one way you have to use a bearing from the front one way... you can only run one or the other, which isnt a problem like i said as they dont effect each other in any way.


i already confirmed it has a carbon chassis, i guess since you dont beleive me you could do what i did a stick a pack of cells against it, or even easier read the box ! :D

Gosh! You didn't have to be so grumpy about it.

In regards to the oneway, many guys in onroad run a double oneway setup in mod to gain more corner speed when steering. I was wondering with the shaft oneway combined with the diff oneway if that would have the same effect in offroad. Also running a spool with the center oneway vs. a diff with a center oneway is different. I was wondering which is easier/ more effective to control in various offroad conditions.

Lastly, I'm not interested in sticking a pack against my chassis but I did read the box. It said clearly that it is a "molded resin" chassis. Last I checked that just only means plastic and not carbon ;) Perhaps if it said "fiber reinforced resin" or "graphite reinforced resin" then we may presume it may be carbon. :rolleyes:

While I'm here, Mark Pavidis car sported a graphite plate battery brace. So far in checking on the options listings, I haven't seen it. Is this a custom or a soon to be availalble option? Also the picture at Speedtech wasn't so clear but the "carbon top deck" option looks to be molded is this true? Will there be a graphite plate topdeck available from either Kyosho or another supplier?

Tall questions, hopefully someone out there who is "in the know" will answer. :)

[relayer]

The optional "carbon" parts ie: top deck and shock towers are in fact carbon-reinforced plastic, so in other words similar to buying the "graphite" composite stuff for the Losi or AE 2wds.

AFAIK they won't be releasing those parts in carbon-fibre, Mark's car at the worlds had no carbon-fibre, with the exception of the battery plate you've mentioned.

[Key]

It said clearly that it is a "molded resin" chassis. Last I checked that just only means plastic and not carbon ;) Perhaps if it said "fiber reinforced resin" or "graphite reinforced resin" then we may presume it may be carbon. :rolleyes:


Correction: It is NOT plastic. The kit does come with a "carbon composite" chassis. The upper deck and the two shock towers are plastic but they are already available in the same chassis material but as "hop-ups". oOple is correct :)

[Laterilus]

Hey all, I just received my kit last night and began building it. I too have put the front one-way diff in there as I've never owned a car with a front one-way so I thought I'd start out there and see how it felt. For those that know how to put them together, the two one-way bearings should be spinning the same way and stopping the same way? For some reason, the instructions looked odd to me and I wasn't understanding too well last night when I was building it. Secondly, the two different options on the front shaft confused me as well. By process of elimination, I figured the standard front shaft would be used in conjunction with the front one-way diff considering there were only two one-way bearings included in the kit... as oople said. Why would you want a front shaft with a one-way bearing in it? Is it meant for use with the spool or normal diff? I'd lik