GSMnow
07-12-2009, 01:59 AM
Well, the qualifying is done at the 12th annual Hot Rod Hobbies Shootout.
I ran poorly, but it was total fun, and we still have the mains all day tomorrow. Now to the reason for this post.
I decided to race in 13.5 truck and 13.5 4WD. This posed a problem as I only have one 13.5 motor/ESC setup.
I hav read a ton about how people say sensored is for racing and sensorless is for bashing etc. I will say right off the Mamba Max ESC does not like 13.5 ROAR legal motors. The Novak motor I was loaned work far better than my Losi motor, but it still not very good on startup. For these higher resistance low KV motors, the sensors make them start, no matter what. For a sensorless ESC to run start these motors well, would take a very different approach. I will be sending some thoughts to Castle about it. Twice in my 4th qualifier, I got caught up near a hil, and the marshal was nice enough to set me on the up grade, OUCH, the car WOULD NOT pull up the hill from a stop.
Once the car is rolling though, even from a very slow speed, the Mamba Max ESC was much nicer to drive than the Losi Xcelorin sensored setup. The power band is smoother, the control is more precise, the top end seemed to pull higher, and the brakes were far stronger. I found myself driving the MM much omre, havng to control the throttle and keep the tires on the edge of grip, where the truck with the Losi sysem just seemed a bit under powered. I was able to use much more throttle more of the time, to the point I was full trigger far more on track, but I still wanted a bit more punch. All in all, the motors both ran very well so far, I just have the 4WD SS main and the triple main for the Old guys. Yup, only one heat of the geezer class, so it is an "A" main right there with same 3 run format as the big dogs.
After this weekend of racing it is very clear why a hybrid ESC will end up being best. The Losi sensored ESC only has an advantage from a dead stop. Even from the slowest corner on the track, the Mamba Max pulled smoother and harder than the sensored ESC and, at any speed past a very slow crawl the Mamba Max ran very delicate and precise. The hybrid using sensors to get rolling and sensorless smarts for the rest of the power curve sure seeks like a bet of both worlds setup. The sensored Losi system has no trigger feel. It is numb and not responsive. The Max power output of both systems was probably very close. With the tight schedule, I was not able to swap the ESC's for a final test, but I did run the very same motor on both systems t get a feel for the ESC difference. My 4WD and my truck are nearly the same in weight, but the MM 13.5 could clear both triples every lap, but the Losi Xcelorin ESC and 13.5 mot just could not do it after about 5 laps, and even when it was fresh, the Losi system just barely made it where the MM had to be pedaled to not land wide, past the down side of the 3rd hill.
All in all, except for the startup, the MM does a far better job of pulling the motor around. I can't wait until the MM Pro comes out with the sensor port. That should make for one wild drive. Sensored does have an edge for startup, especially in bad situations, such as rolling backwards. I sure hope I don't have bad issues in my main tomorrow, I just need it to stay rolling forwards and not crash. Yeah, like that is going to happen. My old reflexes and depth perception certainly kept me from doing better, and my poor showing does not reflect the ability of the ESC's or my vehicles.
Sensorless works great, if they could just make it start a 13.5 motor better.
I ran poorly, but it was total fun, and we still have the mains all day tomorrow. Now to the reason for this post.
I decided to race in 13.5 truck and 13.5 4WD. This posed a problem as I only have one 13.5 motor/ESC setup.
I hav read a ton about how people say sensored is for racing and sensorless is for bashing etc. I will say right off the Mamba Max ESC does not like 13.5 ROAR legal motors. The Novak motor I was loaned work far better than my Losi motor, but it still not very good on startup. For these higher resistance low KV motors, the sensors make them start, no matter what. For a sensorless ESC to run start these motors well, would take a very different approach. I will be sending some thoughts to Castle about it. Twice in my 4th qualifier, I got caught up near a hil, and the marshal was nice enough to set me on the up grade, OUCH, the car WOULD NOT pull up the hill from a stop.
Once the car is rolling though, even from a very slow speed, the Mamba Max ESC was much nicer to drive than the Losi Xcelorin sensored setup. The power band is smoother, the control is more precise, the top end seemed to pull higher, and the brakes were far stronger. I found myself driving the MM much omre, havng to control the throttle and keep the tires on the edge of grip, where the truck with the Losi sysem just seemed a bit under powered. I was able to use much more throttle more of the time, to the point I was full trigger far more on track, but I still wanted a bit more punch. All in all, the motors both ran very well so far, I just have the 4WD SS main and the triple main for the Old guys. Yup, only one heat of the geezer class, so it is an "A" main right there with same 3 run format as the big dogs.
After this weekend of racing it is very clear why a hybrid ESC will end up being best. The Losi sensored ESC only has an advantage from a dead stop. Even from the slowest corner on the track, the Mamba Max pulled smoother and harder than the sensored ESC and, at any speed past a very slow crawl the Mamba Max ran very delicate and precise. The hybrid using sensors to get rolling and sensorless smarts for the rest of the power curve sure seeks like a bet of both worlds setup. The sensored Losi system has no trigger feel. It is numb and not responsive. The Max power output of both systems was probably very close. With the tight schedule, I was not able to swap the ESC's for a final test, but I did run the very same motor on both systems t get a feel for the ESC difference. My 4WD and my truck are nearly the same in weight, but the MM 13.5 could clear both triples every lap, but the Losi Xcelorin ESC and 13.5 mot just could not do it after about 5 laps, and even when it was fresh, the Losi system just barely made it where the MM had to be pedaled to not land wide, past the down side of the 3rd hill.
All in all, except for the startup, the MM does a far better job of pulling the motor around. I can't wait until the MM Pro comes out with the sensor port. That should make for one wild drive. Sensored does have an edge for startup, especially in bad situations, such as rolling backwards. I sure hope I don't have bad issues in my main tomorrow, I just need it to stay rolling forwards and not crash. Yeah, like that is going to happen. My old reflexes and depth perception certainly kept me from doing better, and my poor showing does not reflect the ability of the ESC's or my vehicles.
Sensorless works great, if they could just make it start a 13.5 motor better.