December Issue of RCMicroflight

[Blackhawk]

I subscribe to RCMicroflight because I think (or at least hope) that we will see plans for small rc airplanes--maybe even some scale aor sort of scale plans. I just reviewed the plans this month for the Starship--no offense to the author, but this is not what I subscribe for. Give me a break and at least give me some airplanes or I will find another place to spend my money.


Pat Daily

[Blackhawk]

The more I think about it, the more I am compelled to ask "Where is the Editor's Head?"-- there have been lots of nifty small airplanes on you post a picture forum, but I have yet to see a plan of one lately. Why not? Have you guys lost your mind--we don't fly space ships, we fly airplanes. I am thorougly disappointed. If you really wanna know how I feel, email me.

Pat Daily

[Dave Robelen]

Hello Pat,
You know, if we all share a common interest in model types, a magazine could get a bit boring. In spite of the fact that projects of this sort are not my "thing" I still find that by reading and studying the authors use of materials, techniques and equipment, I usually come away with a bit more knowlege than I had before. BTW, have you submitted one of those lovelies in the pictures? I could learn a bunch from your work! Having seen your models first hand, I sure would like to see them available to more modelers.
Take care, Dave Robelen

[GHMBO]

Pat
Consider yourself lucky to have gotton the December copy. I just picked up my November copy. My copy seems to come at the end of the month for that months issue. I don't expect my December issue until after Christmas.
Like you, I enjoy microscale, but microflight seems to be dominated by "sticks" and foam. I have enjoyed your postings and they have motivated me to chug ahead. I posted 6 plans of scale park flyers and called attention to them and got no replys - so that seems to be no interest in my mind. However, I posted them in DXF files since there was a great outcry for the monthly plans to be in CAD. I am comming to the conclusion that there is little interest in scale,CAD, and in scratch building. We seem to be living in an instant ARF and RTF world.

[Blackhawk]

GHMBO and Dave

Dave, I agree variety is nice --but if I want variety in space ships, then I would go to a space ship mag. It is sort of like having RC flying lawnmowers appear in a model airplane mag. I appreciate your encouragement to submit my designs for publication. Maybe you or someone at the mag could tell us how this works. I don't really want to invest a lot of time in it unless they really want my plane. So far, no one has asked for me to submit any designs.

GHGMBO, I agree there have been many nifty planes, but the editors never seem to contact anyone about submitting them for publication. I remember some comments (Ralph Bradley, Gordon Johnson, etc) indicating they send articles in to be published and hear nothing. I always thought, as editor of MAX FAX for many years, that an editor's job was to help find appropriate content. It seems to me, that if the editors listen to their audience and respond accordingly, they might just be successful and maybe even make some money. If they don't listen, they are doomed.

Pat Daily

[Dave Robelen]

Hello Pat,
About the issue of design submission. The vast majority of my articles have been unsolicited submissions that I submitted to the various magazines. With the rare exception, the editors do not seek out material unless the project is something like a nats winner, etc.
When I submit an article, the package includes a manuscript that includes building instructions, photographs, either film or high resolution digital on CD, and a hand drawn full size plan sheet. The plan is normally copied in ink by their contract draftsman for publication. This cycle is pretty much typical for all of the mags I have submitted to. The problem with the editors soliciting from someone unfamiliar to them is related to their lack of knowlege regarding the individuals capabilities. Can they write well? How about clear photos including the flight shots? What kind of work do they do in the drafting department? And finally, last but not least, is the subject likely to be sufficiently interesting to readers?
In the case of your lovelies, there is little doubt of the appeal, but typically, an editor will want to see the complete package before making a commitment.
It is troubling that most magazines have a problem acknowledging a submission. I normally wait a while, and then contact them to see if they received the package OK. This is about the most you will hear from a magazine until near the time they are ready to publish the project.
As far as the nature of the projects, I remember a sweet little Bellanca biplane that was published in RCMiroflight by Thayer Sheets, but I gather that they are getting few submissions in this area. So far I have had good success with the simpler sport models that might have a scale-like look, and of course the little Mustang really struck a nerve. You really don't know for sure about the ultimate success of a project until the mags have it on hand and can blend it with the other content in an issue.
I hope I have answered some of the questions.
Regards, Dave Robelen

[Blackhawk]

Thanks Dave, you did help fill in the process on submitting stuff. I have only done it once--a Fiat G-50 many years ago in Model Aviation.

I have also done several for MAX FAX over the years, but that is a journal for Free Flighters and not so critical as a magazine.

I do acknowledge that RC Microflight has had some nice stuff--your Mustang, Don Srull' Microbipe and Thayers Bellanca were all super -- I guess I expect to see that trend continue and hope it will.

Pat

[frankenfoamy]

I concur with Dave's observation.
I have had 5 planes published and all were unsolicited accept one.
There is considerable expense in having plans drawn by other than the author. While I can not speak for the editors, I think they are concerned about getting themselves into a project that will cost them more than they planned.

A known author helps here as the editors know what they can get.

DXF plans don't always view and print on another computer as they do on yours. Supplying the Mag with a full size hard copy is a big plus. Or offer to provide them.

Typically, I supply a gif of the plans and several construction photos when I ask if there is interest in an article. A flight photo is a big plus. (video does not hurt either) If there is interest, I supply a package including all hard copy.

IE the starhip was submitted to 5 different mags. All expressed interest accept Model Aviation. RCMICROFLIGHT was the first to respond. ( All responded within 48 hours except MA)

There is not much money in the sale, so that will hinder some from putting out the effort. I do it to share ideas, hoping others will do the same. While the starship may not be someones cup of tea, it exposes some people to 1. foam construction 2. getting pictures from the web and using them as coverings. 3. aerodynamics of unconventional planforms. 4. using cheap materials (foam, paint sticks, bamboo) 5. stimulate younger minds that do not relate to warbirds.

The editors have always been helpful and gracious about not beating me up over grammatical errors.

So give it a try.

[MicroPhil]

And I quote
"To boldly go where no micro flyer has gone before"

My question where does Micro end and HUGE start?

Philip

[nolasco]

What's wrong about publishing an article describing the construction of an RC starship (or even of a flying lawnmower for that matter)? I have seen pictures of RC flying dinosaurs, witches on broomsticks, and other really weird things. I always have a laugh seeing them and think that their creators have really creative minds.

Some people consider the IFO, Mouse, and Kolibri as not "real" RC planes. For a time, even electrics were not considered RC models, just mere toys for kids. Guess what? That doesn't seem to have stopped countless flyers (including myself) from having fun with these so called "non-models".

By the way, one my possible winter projects (if and whenever I get to it), is the "new" (or old, depending on your point of view) starship Enterprise. It will be built using carbon fiber and ripstop nylon and patterned after the Mouse.

Jun Nolasco

[MicroPhil]

I don't have any problems with a Micro Starship, but when the motor weighs more than what I consider Micro? I pay 30 dollars for a Micro letter.
Philip

[Blackhawk]

Guys

I started this and I what I am concerned about is that if the feature original construction article each month (assuming there is a construction article each month--I think there have been some months when there were no original construction articles) is not a microrc airplane, then I think the magazine is letting the readers down. I expect an airplane each month--that is why I subscribe. I don't mind other stuff --like the space ship--although I would not really wanna see boats, cars, tanks, motorcycles, etc. in this magazine. It just seems airplanes ought to be the major focus.

Pat

[Dave Robelen]

Hi Pat,
Bearing in mind that I am not an employee of AirAge and have no inside information, The main intent of splitting the Backyard Flyer off from the RCMicroflight was to open up the newsletter format of the Microflight to more technical model issues. I am certain that the intention is to stay with aircraft, after all they publish other mags for the surface vehicles. There does appear to be a lower quantity of scale models submitted for them to work with. Meanwhile, why not drop the editors a line at RCMicroflight@airage.com and get the word from the source. Nice folks, they will give you the straight stuff.
Regards, Dave Robelen

[pease1]

Frankenfoamy,

I applaud your design, clever and very intersting. I may even build one. Well done. I also don't mind out-of-the-box design subjects. This is RC Microflight - not RC Microscaleaircraft.

I have to agree with others though, that while your design would be great for Backyard Flyer magazine or similar, I don't consider speed 400 sized planes RC Microflight material. To be honest, speed 280 is what I consider tops size wise for what I expect from this magazine. Not your fault though - it's the publisher's fault.

That said, I did enjoy this months cloud 9, and review articles, and the GWS prop saver article was also a nice addition. All in all an above average issue. And I already have my printed copy in-hand, for a change it came early in the month.

To the editors: Please, less Speed 400, more Micro models.

Thanks,
Allan Wright

[frankenfoamy]

Allan,
I agree with you.
There are other places for S400.
I would not be surprised to see the Star ship in the the Backyard flyer in some form.
My gut feeling is that there is a scant number of micro plane submissions.

Come everyone, get your name up in lights, submit your designs!

[cometkid]

Gentlemen,
This is a valuable thread. Having some experience at two designs at the bigger end of the spectrum http://home.flash.net/~cometkid/ of sailplane modeling, I can agree with all of the above comments. I'd love to submit a scale model design as a park flier. You all may have inspired me to take a chance, hit the drawing board and get a prototype into the air.

But we're talking a labor of love. No one of us is going to garner huge checks for our work. I was just perusing a book of early British ultralights and noted the Avro 560 would be a good subject (as would several entered in the Lympne competition) as a motorglider using the GWS DX-A motor. The labor comes in the microengineering, testing and scheming; and the love comes from the visual appeal of the design. (Don Srull did an Avro 560 as an early micro electric free flight some time ago in Model Aviation.)

Finally, Dave's right on the mark with his detailed commentary. You should submit a complete package to an editor. If you aren't a fair technical writer, find a flying buddy who can do it for you. Can't find the documentation for that aircraft? Put the word out on this board. But, above all, don't do it for the bucks. There's not enough of them to compensate us for these labors of love. Do it because you love it and want to share it with the rest of us.

[Buddly6]

ok, this is the way I see it. If we want a good plan of the month we have to do it OURSELVES? and then Pay to acess OUR plans that WE made?? c'mon airage, you guys can do MUCH better then THAT!

lets see

5000 subscribers

30$ a subscriber

5000 x 30 = 150000 dollars!?!

and THIS is what we get, for our $150,000 we get a 15 page two color mag with a few columns and WE have to SUBMIT our OWN plans?

[Dave Robelen]

Hi Buddly6,
Let's try and put things in perspective. Yes, you get a 15 page 2-color magazine. Meanwhile you are most likely looking at the material on the website in full color and occasionally more detail.
As for the finances, I don't have a clue as to how they budget this publication, but when we get a magazine without paid advertisement someone has to pay the bill. Personally, I appreciate at least one small magazine that is nothing but editorial content. Do I wish it cost less? you bet, but I feel the same way about the best micro servos, etc. I can do without, try to get the material on my own, or ante up and enjoy.
On that bit about the plans, when I submit material to a magazine there is a lot more content than just plans. Aside from the fame and glory;), a lot more modelers get to see my work and have a shot at duplicating it. If all you want is free plans with limited circulation, there appear to be several websites with something to offer. I don't know when you last had a large document printed ( or redrawn by a master draftsman on contract), but there is money involved in making full size plans available.
One of the toughest issues the editorial staff have been facing is how to get the free downloadable plans into a format that is reasonably universal. It seems every effort to try a new system results in problems for someone. Even with this they are still working the issue to make trhese plans available.
There, I said it, Dave robelen

[GHMBO]

I agree with almost everyone, the newsletter is crappy, but it is the best that we have. I would like to see some more tech stuff. Product pandering is fine, but I am more interested in new tech developments and how things work. With our heavy use of electrical things, a colum explaining what makes them work would be welcomed by me. I am blessed with a tech background and can mostly figure stuff out. I also would like to see some building techniques explained. We seem to be evolving from stick ARFs to semiscale ARF and to some extent to scratch building. I would hope that the newsletter would reflect this evolution.

[Dave Robelen]

Hi GHMBO,
Check out the Cloud 9 column this month (January). Pretty basic, but a good start. Toss out some desired topics and I will talk to the staff.
Regards, Dave Robelen

[Ralph B]

Dave:
Thanks for your posts, and the perspective they have provided. I'm basicly happy with R/C Microflight. I would be willing to buy it for the Cloud 9 column, and a couple of your designs alone. Based on what most publications charge for full size plans (with shipping), I doubt if you could get more than 2 or 3 sets for the price of the MicroFlight subscription. On a yearly basis, I certinly feel that I am getting a lot more information from R/C MicroFlight than I would get from 2 or 3 sets of plans.
A couple of things that worry me about the future viability of the magazine, are the inclusion of what I would consider to be "non-micro" models, and more of what I would call "what to buy" articles rather than "what to build" articles. I agree that if we want more "how to" content, it will have to come from some of the readers. I also agree with Pat, that it's the editor's job to solicit this material. Expecting someone to do the work of preparing an article on a contingency basis, seems to me, to be like expecting a brick mason to build a wall around someones home and then asking if the homeowner wants to buy it. I think if a brief article proposal format was employed, where the prospective authors could submit a summary of the project, the editors might find they have much more to work with.
There has been some discussion about the plans format, and the costs of providing full size plans in the magazine. Based on your experience, do you think there is any interest (from the editors) in presenting a full size plan as part of the printed copy, if the plan was limited to one, or one and a half 8" X 10" pages? I know of a few good designs that are small enough to be presented in this manner. Thanks again for all you contribute here.

Ralph B

[losiboy]

It does cost $$ to run a large website. They have to pay graphic people and web design and not to mention bandwidth fees. Just somthing eles to think about..

[CDNshy_guy]

The online Magzine is worth the money. I applied in November for membership and only recieved a bill from microflight. I'll pay the bill because it's woth it to down the plans and print them from home or work, but it would be nice to get the paper mag.

I have downloaded all the plans and I think it's great that they offer them in so many file formats.
I've downloaded over 150 plans from the web now but they are mostly in caad format. I tried printing them at work but they try to print 100 pages (Mostly blank).

I can't seem to figure out how to crop or conver them to jpg.
Also It would be nice if the rcmicroflight plans where scale.
the Flying Ace Stick is about 30% to small when you print it.

Norm
P.S. Keep up the good work rcmicroflight ( I am a star trek fan)

[CDNshy_guy]

And another thing!
I just joined and I was able to download plans from previous months.
If I was running it I would make everyone pay for the previous plans or maybe a % of the price.

[Blackhawk]

Well the thought occured to me that I have been a subscribing member now for 2 or 3 years (getting old and can't remember which is which) but if I should no longer subscribe, then I can't get the downloads that I paid for. Now I gotta tell ya, I have yet to download any, but I came real close with the beautiful Bellanca from Thayer Syme--I would have downloaded but I am not sure I want it bad enough to go thru the effort of getting a lotta sheets to paste together. But still, I have paid for the right to download these guys and would loose it if I no longer subscribe. Then what happens if I never subscribed for several years, then for one subscription of $29, I get several years worth of plans. I am still scratching my head on this one.

The January issue looks a bit more interesting, but very THIN. And some of the cloud 9 stuff was already published or made available on ezone or on this chat group.

Pat Daily

[Dave Robelen]

Hi Ralph & friends,
I will be talking with the staff and will bring up the issues you guys are raising. Also, at least one staff editor generally is following this BB and is aware of the issues. About the concept of editorial solicitation, that is a tricky one. For one thing, they don't have a clue as to what is right around the corner in submissions, and until they get to know your work, it is unlikely that an editor of any of our model mags would authorize a complete package based on an outline. Another approach that you will find useful is to call the office in Conneticut and ask for Tom Atwood or Debra Sharp. Along with being able to give you pointers about the details, they can fill you in on which type of material they are thin on. If a bunch of folks start submitting very similar projects at the same time, someone is going to be dissapointed unnecessarily.
Regards, Dave Robelen

[GHMBO]

Dave
Your comments about the editors is one of the reasons that I have several times proposed a way to upload mini-articles and plans to be share by the members of this board. The editors could look them over and encourage a full article of things useful. Just looking at the number of subject hits shows the board interest. We know that there are members who are on the cutting edge and they share some of their stuff with us. We saw an interesting interchange on aeronautics that I found very interesting, and way above my head.

Some of the electrical articles that I would like to see are "How do they work" type. Sort of the general education type that dispells the magic. I would like to see an article on how battery chargers work, how they sense peak charge and how lithium-Ion differ from ni-cad chargers. I would like to know how to drive magnetic actuators with our current recievers. I would like to know how an ESC works as well as the BEC and brake. The list is endless, but you can see what I am getting at.

Yes, I like the Cloud 9 and In the current issue, I enjoyed the article on the cutting edge batteries and how to use them.

I hope that with you as the conduit and everyone praiseing and critizing our newsletter, that it will become more useful as time passes.