Novak's brushless system ESC relibility question

superben · #1 06-11-2003, 07:19 PM

Just read the 7/03 RCCA article about the bushless system, it seems perfect for my lazy habit of not having to do any maintenance. However, i notice the temp. of the ESC is almost 100F higher than the conventional ESC. The brushless motor, from my understanding, will have almost zero mainteance, which is because the ESC is doing extra job of alternating the current. I wonder what the reliability of the ESC will be.

Also, what is the expected run time for a brushless system installed on a Yokomo MR4 with stock gearings and 2400 matched pack?

SixVi6-Camaro · #2 06-11-2003, 08:20 PM

well I have one on my TC3 and have run it in the 200+ deg range every time I run it. I've had no problems and have not heard of any issues with controller. I know of two other people that run the Novak SS and have yet to report a single issue. Runtime will probably be in the 10 minute range on average but it will greatly vary depending on how much full throttle driving you do and the condition of the packs.

JeepsDaddy · #3 06-11-2003, 11:53 PM

i've had mine since you could first buy them... i'm tortured mine... i've tried to blow it up....

it still works perfect...

props to Novak for an awesome product...

btw... not working on motors in not a "lazy" habit.... it is an unneeded task on toy cars.....

peace out.....

superben · #4 06-12-2003, 10:43 AM

I have off road/on-road (stock + modified), nitro cars to race + a full-time job and two real cars to work on. I really don't have time to take care of my RC equipment.

captainoblivious · #5 06-12-2003, 12:49 PM

I love my novak in my TC3. I get about 15 minutes of runtime with matched 2400's, but that is not WOT all the time.

Only problem I had was 1 puddle of water, thankfully nothing happened as only a few splashes got on the controller.

JEEL · #6 06-12-2003, 01:08 PM

I have owned 2 of them for my race vehicles. Both were from the first batch sent out. I did have a problem with one of the controllers. Novak replaced it quickly and stated that it must have been a first run issue. Since then, both have been perfect!

HiAmplidude · #7 06-12-2003, 01:14 PM

I have a buddy who runs one in his Losi trip-X on the track. He's new to BL and hasn't quite grasped the urgent need to gear appropriately and has his geared way too high because he likes how it "trims the fat" from take-off torque. His system gets very hot, very fast (duh), but the Novak just keeps on tickin', amazingly.

JeepsDaddy · #8 06-12-2003, 07:04 PM

i feel the exact same way superben... the less time i spend jerking around on toy car motors, the more time i have for real fun... (like driving my r/c's, chics, bench racing, riding mx, looking at nudie pics on the net, getting 911 wings at Hooters, and on and on and on... the really important stuff in life ya know... LOL...)

peace out...

losiracer03 · #9 06-13-2003, 06:25 PM

I have one in my XXX-T it is the fastest motor i have ever ran. The only problem i have had is i fried the on/off switch. So i soldered on a new switch and it runs fine.

fishtale17 · #10 06-14-2003, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by losiracer03
I have one in my XXX-T it is the fastest motor i have ever ran. The only problem i have had is i fried the on/off switch. So i soldered on a new switch and it runs fine.

1 quick question? what spur/ pinion are you running. I am using 18/86.

boostspike · #11 06-15-2003, 11:11 AM

i am VERY interested in gettin the Novak SS. Most likely by the end on June i should have one..

i'm gonna install it into my RS4 Pro... the car is basically stock outta the box except for the basic things (esc, motor, springs).. stock pinion 35t 64pitch, spur gear 122t 64pitch

Do i need any "supporting" parts when i order the SS??? like gears, CVD, pinions, etc.... or is what i have good enough

lastly, is the SS too powerful for its own good. meaning does it break or strip any parts related to the chassis...

Thanks All...

DualBL · #12 06-15-2003, 11:44 AM

you should be fine with what you have.

the SS is NOT too powerfull for it's own good. that's why it's so talked about at the track

Nitro Fans · #13 06-16-2003, 08:20 AM

Hello,

I used to own three set of the ss system ( one set got damaged after repeated acceleration and braking in a small indoor carpet track ).

The menu recommends gear ratio no smaller than 6.5:1, but I find out it is having too much torque ( just like a nitro ) with that combination so I normally play with ratio like 5.5:1. I also find out at a ratio of ~5.2:1, my touring car is significantly much faster than a 9 -turn motor with 8:1 gear ratio.

However, I become worry one day after I discover the ESC heat sink is 120 degree celcius and the motor is 80 degree with such combination. It may be the reason why one them got damaged.

How about yours, what gear ratios are you using.

CharlieS · #14 06-16-2003, 11:26 AM

Nitro Fans, You are way overgeared. If the ESC and motor are getting that hot, you are shortening your runtimes for one, but more than that you are repeatedly pushing the ESC to it's temp limit. That's not a very good idea. If the motor has too much torque, over gearing it is NOT the answer. That is the worse thing you can do. You should gear it properly and adapt your driving style a little more.

The Gearing Recomendations in the manual are correct of for On Road Sedan Applications, for Offroad please see the update on our website.

I've said this before and I'm sure I'll say it again. Most customers that have installed an SS into their car and run it at their local track, have reported that speed is similar to an 11 or 12 turn motor. The gearing is MUCH different, but the "Speed on the track" is similar. For on road it really depends on the track as to how "Fast" the system feels and is effected more by proper gearing selection.

Thanks,
Charlie

crono man · #15 06-16-2003, 08:45 PM

hey guys need some input from ss users

i was running my ss today in my xxx buggy(i had a 9.5ratio)halfway thru my run i asked my friend to check the temp of the esc with a temp gun and it read 235F i let the esc cool down then i used another pack and it ran fine to me!
do you guys think something could have been damaged even tho the esc is running fine after overheating?
do any of you guys got it that high?
its weird my tranny has no binding and the ratio is as novak recommends!
i dont wont to send it in if i dont have to as i have alot of races coming up and i live in canada so its going to be atleast 2week turnaround

am i being just paranoid?

thanks for any input

superben · #16 06-17-2003, 10:48 AM

Remember RCCA recorded very high temp. with the ESC too, that's why I opened this thread and asked for ESC reliability.

CharlieS · #17 06-17-2003, 10:53 AM

Crono- That sounds very high, we are seeing normal operating temps in the 160-180 range for most applications. Your setup does not sound any different. Try gearing down a tooth or two and see how it effects speed. There may be no difference in speed, but the heating will be reduced. As you reach the gearing limit, the motor will stay the same speed, but the ESC will get a lot hotter. Are you using normal "off road" tires? Larger street tires would need a lower gearing.

Thanks
Charlie

crono man · #18 06-17-2003, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CharlieS
Crono- That sounds very high, we are seeing normal operating temps in the 160-180 range for most applications. Your setup does not sound any different. Try gearing down a tooth or two and see how it effects speed. There may be no difference in speed, but the heating will be reduced. As you reach the gearing limit, the motor will stay the same speed, but the ESC will get a lot hotter. Are you using normal "off road" tires? Larger street tires would need a lower gearing.

Thanks
Charlie

yes im using normal losi buggy tires

so now my ratio is at 9.5:1 so maybe 10:1 would be better?
i know this sounds weird but do you think a bigger pinion gear would actually lower heating?

(im stumped because usually my esc stay in the 160-180 range but yesterday it went way up and i havent changed my usual gearing the only thing i did differently is that i used the reverse alot to get out of crashes during my practice run at the track but when haflway thru my pack my friend temp gunned the esc at 235F my jaw nearly dropped)

i really like this system and i hope nothing is wromg with it.

thank you for your input charlie

crono man · #19 06-17-2003, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by superben
Remember RCCA recorded very high temp. with the ESC too, that's why I opened this thread and asked for ESC reliability.

how high temp did RCCA record during the test?

CharlieS · #20 06-17-2003, 11:46 AM

So this just happened one time? If that's the case there's nothing to worry about, one hot cycle wont hurt it. A taller final drive number is actually a Smaller Pinion Gear, not larger.

Using reverse "a lot" will make the ESC get significantly hotter than if you don't use it all, or just use it one or two times.

Thanks
Charlie

crono man · #21 06-17-2003, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CharlieS
So this just happened one time? If that's the case there's nothing to worry about, one hot cycle wont hurt it. A taller final drive number is actually a Smaller Pinion Gear, not larger.

Using reverse "a lot" will make the ESC get significantly hotter than if you don't use it all, or just use it one or two times.

Thanks
Charlie

cool then maybe i was just too worried

one last question
doesnt the ESC have a thermal cut-off so to protect it if it gets too hot?

CharlieS · #22 06-17-2003, 12:28 PM

Yes, there is thermal protection, but if it gets really hot over time, the heat build up will somewhat creep up. This would allow it to operate at an over temperature state for some time while the temp raised throughout. It's not good to rely on the temperature protection.

Thanks,
Charlie

crono man · #23 06-18-2003, 07:11 PM

charlie,

my friend wants to use the novak with 7cells in his tc3 almost all the time.
is there a cause for concern about the novak overheating?
when using 7cells should he stick to the recomanded ratio?

thanks

CharlieS · #24 06-18-2003, 07:14 PM

If concerned, you could gear it lower to reduce heat. Maybe a tooth or two, but if it were mine, I wouldn't worry to much. These things are pretty durable. We've surpised ourselves many times during testing.

Thanks
Charlie

JeepsDaddy · #25 06-19-2003, 12:42 AM

yo Charlie.....

man... i gave you guys at Novak sooooo much trouble over missed release dates... heck.... i was probably one of the reasons you guys closed the "Orange Room"... LOL... (i give the guys at Orion just as much trouble though... LOL)

but i can not recommend your SS BL system highly enough... it is everything you said it would be, it was worth every bit of extra waiting, and it is more than worth every penny...

when i see the guys on this board asking which brushed motor they should buy now... i just wanna scream "BUY THE SS and you'll save SOOOO much money and have so much more fun"... anyone buying a new brushed mod for anything except for ROAR sanctioned events is just rolling up 50 dollar bills and burning them....

props to Novak on a great BL system.... and the balls to see outside the box, build it themselves, and put it on the market...

TheRealStern

peace out.....